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Pooh-Bah
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Pooh-Bah
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My grandson pointed to a ditch and stone wall arrangement in the grounds of a local ‘stately home’ and said: what’s that? I told him that it was a ha-ha. That meant a lot more explanation was needed! If you don’t know of it, it is a ditch that slopes down from pastureland and has the opposite side formed from a vertical stone wall with its top level with the lawn on the garden side. The depth of the ditch and wall varies depending on what animals you aim to keep out of the garden. The object of the ha-ha was to keep farm animals out of formal gardens without spoiling the view across the grounds.
I am left wondering, is the UK is the only place that used the ha-ha (doesn’t form a good plural!), and if it’s used elsewhere does it have the same name? It’s a pretty simple idea, so I would guess it’s common enough.
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Carpal Tunnel
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Dear dxb: I've never heard of or seen a ha-ha in US. I think that grazing animals are seldom adjacent to large expensive estates. And an electric fence on property of animal owners would be most common solution.
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Pooh-Bah
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Haven't heard of a ha-ha here but I've always loved the combination of idea and name. Our closest equivalent would be a cattle gate. It is a ditch about a meter deep crossing a road in place of a standard gate. There are round pipes set in the top perpendicular to the road about 4 inches apart so that cars can rattle across without stopping to open and close a standard gate but the cows are afraid to stepp on it and won't cross and escape.
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Carpal Tunnel
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This is definitely a YART, but I haven't the time to go Search, just now. But somebody, maverick I think, posted a link to a picture or two. I think it's pretty unique to the UK. I'm posting this because just last night, a good friend asked me at choir practice if I knew what it was! He said it's a good crossword puzzle word.
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addict
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http://snurl.com/2sk1 for a brief discussion, the site keeps on dropping out when I try to do searches so no more from me today.
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Carpal Tunnel
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Carpal Tunnel
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Definitely a crossword puzzle word and not much else in the US&A.
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old hand
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old hand
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When I was younger I read a couple of books, by an Englishman abroad (?), who later moved to England and continued writing these works - scathingly satirical and mind-sharpeningly funny. His name: Tom Sharpe. Perhaps most famous these days for Wilt, Blott on the Landscape and Porterhouse Blue.
His first two books, however, Riotous Assembly and Indecent Exposure were set in South Africa/modern Namibia/modern Zimbabwe, and I recall (I think it was in the first book?) that the Donford Yates-reading 'English' expats there had hahas. At least, there was a moment in the book when someone fell into the haha, which had been dug so deep and wide it was a hazard to life and limb - for everybody.
The peerless Terry PRatchett, of course, has the Patrician sitting on his lawn, casually sending the leader of the Assassin's Guild into a haha designed by Berghold Stuttley (Bloody Stupid) Johnson, that was so large it was no longer a haha, but a hoho. So there are hahas on Discworld.
Any South Africans here to confirm fictional sightings of hahas in the Rainbow Nation?
cheer
the sunshine warrior
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Pooh-Bah
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Pooh-Bah
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Thanks for digging that up, Jackie. I was going to provide a link but, really, that site says everything.
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Carpal Tunnel
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We called these 'cattle guards' when I was growing up in the Ozark Mountains.
Here's a pic for people who have never encountered one:
http://www.agry.purdue.edu/ext/forages/rotational/images/fencing/cattle_guard.JPG
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Great image! [Newby question: How did you get your URL to light up as a 'clickable' link?]
I've only seen ha-ha's in English gardening books -- and up close and personal in a couple of English gardens as well. Very clever idea. Love the name.
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Carpal Tunnel
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Carpal Tunnel
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Newby question:
You got 23 posts to go before you get to be a newbie.
Check the FAQ link up at the top of the page for the answer to that question and many more and enjoy being strange for a while.
And welcome.
BTW, don't know about the Ozarks, but in Arizona sometimes they just painted the cattle guards on the roads.
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Pooh-Bah
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Pooh-Bah
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We have those cattle gates/guards that Zed described in the UK too, but whereas they protect an entrance way, the ha-ha usually runs for a considerable length. Interesting name you have, gift horse. I won't ask about your teeth. 
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Thanks for pointing out the FAQ. I'll check them out. Afraid I'm destined to always be strange regardless of the number of times I post. ;-)
So, painted cattle guards worked to keep the bovine from roaming, huh? I've never heard of that. Just goes to prove that cattle are not exactly intellectual giants.
[moo]
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Carpal Tunnel
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not exactly intellectual giants.
I wondered about that. If nothing else it proves they don't have to stick their feet into them to realize what will happen.
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Carpal Tunnel
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Carpal Tunnel
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I'm destined to always be strangeThen you'll fit right in!! ...and no, I won't say the obvious about your mouth. Welcome.
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Pooh-Bah
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We have those cattle gates/guards .... in the UK too,but we call them "cattle grids" - even when they are there to keep sheep out 
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Pooh-Bah
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As long as they don't keep (gift) horses out.
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Carpal Tunnel
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but they are used to keep (gift) horses in... on areas like the Preseli Hills with ancient pasturage rights, there are free roaming ponies which are only kept from straying onto the main roads by cattle grids on the minor routes bisecting the hills. oh, yeah, and the sheep... http://westwales.co.uk/graphics/preseli.jpg
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Carpal Tunnel
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"Cattle stops" here, and that holds for all (b)ovine prisoners.
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Beautiful country! I wouldn't mind being 'kept in' there...as long as I got plenty of oats and a good rub-down every night.
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Carpal Tunnel
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In reply to:
Beautiful country!
Hmm, There be dragons, doncha know? 15 of them were breathing much fire just a couple of days ago.
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Carpal Tunnel
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Carpal Tunnel
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c'mare and let me whisper something to you... ;)
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Carpal Tunnel
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Carpal Tunnel
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formerly known as etaoin...
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Hmm, There be dragons, doncha know?
Do dragons eat horses?
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c'mare and let me whisper something to you... ;)
Are you foaling with me?
(Sorry, couldn't resist).
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Thank you for the kind welcome. I've received the AWAD e-mails for ages. There seems to be a lot of clever and intelligent folks hanging out here. It's a fun place to learn a thing or two, that's for sure.
Thanks again!
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Carpal Tunnel
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You're most welcome GF - bearing gifts or not Back to original post... In Québec we have a couple of Ha-Ha places, most notably, Saint-Louis-du-Ha-Ha. I can't find anythink that looks like a Ha-Ha you discribe but the place was founded in 1873 so the Ha-ha's could conceivably have been filled/plowed under/built upon....
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Pooh-Bah
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I just remembered a friend carefully explaining to me that the cattle grids were actually underpasses for cattle so the cows could cross the road without risking getting hit by cars. I immediately pictured cowboys ( I grew up in cowboy country) trying to train the cows.
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Carpal Tunnel
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Carpal Tunnel
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cattle grids were actually underpasses for cattle so the cows could cross the road without risking getting hit by cars. Speaking of ha-has...!
Welcome aBoard, gift horse! clever and intelligent folks Something tells me you'll fit right in.
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If nothing else it proves they don't have to stick their feet into them to realize what will happen.
Maybe that is a sign of intelligence...cow intelligence at least. Maybe the cow is imagining what could happen if the painted grill is real and she might fall through. Or not. I wonder if there is a Peabody Individual Achievement Test for cows. (?) ;-)
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Carpal Tunnel
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Maybe that is a sign of intelligence...cow intelligence at least.
Prezackly.
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Pooh-Bah
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The reason that cows don't cross painted cattle stops is that they've seen the "wet paint" sign. Don't give them credit for imagination, for pete's sake!
Speaking of which, I used to repair holes in the fence around our farm with electric fence tape which wasn't connected to any power source. Kept the neighbour's cows out a treat!
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Pooh-Bah
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The last time I went to the zoo I noticed that many of the animal enclosures had the same arrangement of a relatively short wall or fence in conjunction with a ditch, which afforded the same benefit of containing the animals and preserving the view.
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Carpal Tunnel
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Carpal Tunnel
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short wall or fence in conjunction with a ditch, which afforded the same benefit of containing the animals and preserving the view. Yes, and if any kookaburras are in that zoo, then woe betide the unwary animal who falls in. Gee--in this instance, could a kookaburra be said to be crowing?
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Pooh-Bah
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Pooh-Bah
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Jackie, you leave my wife outta this!
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Carpal Tunnel
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Carpal Tunnel
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Fell in a few times, have you?
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