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Posted By: themilum Art Today: The World in Decline - 04/30/07 02:16 AM
http://entertainment.timesonline.co.uk/tol/arts_and_entertainment/visual_arts/article1723156.ece

Got balls?

In words explain the worth of Warhol's work.

Betcha can't!
Posted By: Faldage Re: Art Today: The World in Decline - 04/30/07 11:14 AM
It causes people to talk about art.
Posted By: BranShea Re: Art Today: The World in Decline - 04/30/07 01:07 PM
So you mean the value of the work lies in being entertainment?'
Is that all ? Conversation pieces?

The worth of the work of Andy Warhol was and still is making money go round.Auctioneers, catalogue editors,writers, graphic designers, printers, investment advisors, investors, art critics, museum tourism, galery owners and I might overlook some others categories live and benefit from his business called Art.

I do not say anything about the value of the contents of his oeuvre. Andy Warhol invented an artfactory and apparently the business is still going well.
Posted By: zmjezhd Re: Art Today: The World in Decline - 04/30/07 02:59 PM
The article got one thing wrong. Warhol's parents were Ruthenians from Slovakia and not Czechs. There's a Warhol Family Museum in Medzilaborce, Slovakia. That factoid probably has nothing to do with his artworks' financial or artistic worth.
Posted By: Myridon Re: Art Today: The World in Decline - 04/30/07 05:05 PM
Originally Posted By: themilum
In words explain the worth of Warhol's work.

Betcha can't!


"Talking about art is like dancing about architecture."
- Laurie Anderson quoting Frank Zappa
Posted By: BranShea Re: Art Today: The World in Decline - 04/30/07 06:30 PM
Talking about art is like walking a rope. To me.
Art has always been a means of communication. Whether with the Gods or with fellow humans and/or the artist' self, it has communicated magic, ideals, devotion, genious. admiration, discoveries, love,humor, maddness, sentimentality, drama, pompousness and ambition, despair. Beauty.

Conjuring the mystery and being fascinated by the beauty and mystery of universal creation comes closest to the main motive for the making of art.
(meaning music, archtecture, dance, painting, sculpture, litterature, poetry, theatre, film, photography, crafts.) Everything.
It would be a long story to go through the different purposes and meanings of art in the course of the ages. And it 's confusing in present days, after both art and philosophy (always interacting ) have been more than once been declared dead.

Themilums's question , to give an answer in words about the worth of Andy Warhol's work , I would gladly and easily put away with as : It is none of this mentioned here above. (ambition, yes) Others may fight this point of vieuw. (and how sure can I be?))
Yes, a work of art can always be a conversation piece if you want, but there should be more to it. IMO. Making art should be more than throwing a surprise party and impressing the world with BIG and MANY and masking theories.

Art and philosophy have till recently played a leading part in cultural and also social changes, but somehow there is no longer an answer to the never ending demand for renewal.

There's (postmodernism) been a lot of recycling done the last decades and many things presented as new are stolen or borrowed from the past. Andy Warhol's pop art still was something new. But Campbell's cans of tomatoe soup or the many colored prints of Monroe do not really strike me with awe.
( that is personal value giving).Warhol was a remarkeable personality and a clever business man and networker.

(For renewal science is the only field that still can come up with real discoveries.)

(All this is IMO )

P.S Seen in the context of art as a means of communication Andy Warhol was an advertising man. That's what he had to say. Advertising in an entertaining and often specticular way.
Making good show of himself. The art world loved it.


Posted By: Buffalo Shrdlu Re: Art Today: The World in Decline - 04/30/07 06:58 PM
> marquant

?
Posted By: BranShea Re: Art Today: The World in Decline - 04/30/07 07:10 PM
Sorry, I meant remarkeable but stronger than that and I can't find the word. Something meaning putting his mark on the world.
(?)

Come to think of it, he more often put someone elses mark on the world.
Posted By: zmjezhd Re: Art Today: The World in Decline - 04/30/07 07:13 PM
marquant

French for 'striking, remarkable, outstanding, eminent, prestigious'.

[Pipped by Branshea.]
Posted By: Buffalo Shrdlu Re: Art Today: The World in Decline - 04/30/07 09:10 PM
thanks.

> French for

wondered why it didn't show up in OneLook.
Posted By: zmjezhd Re: Art Today: The World in Decline - 04/30/07 11:55 PM
wondered why it didn't show up in OneLook

'Cause it indexes English language dictionaries? For Dutch, I use Woordenboek der Nederlandsche Taal. For French, Le Trésor de la Langue Française Informatisé. For German, Das Deutsche Wörterbuch von Jacob und Wilhelm Grimm. There excellent, largish national dictionaries of the languages in question and nothing quite beats an unabridged, historical, monolingual dictionary which also happens to be online. For Sanskrit, Monier-Williams' Sanskrit-English Dictionary is online, too.
Posted By: BranShea Re: Art Today: The World in Decline - 05/01/07 09:47 AM
Hey!special!ZjM. I checked the brothers on Wikipedia. Never knew that the brothers Grimm of the gruwesome fairytales did a Dictionary that apparantly still is useful.

By the way, one of the other famous fairytale collectors, Hans Christian Andersen wrote the fairy tale that associates well with the original subject of this tread :

The Emperor's new Clothes

Often this fairy tale is used as a methaphor for art that everybody gives praise to, but is doubtful in it's integrety.

Posted By: AnnaStrophic Re: words - 05/01/07 12:21 PM
The Emperor's New Clothes is a wonderful, and ever-apt story.

More on the Grimms and their consonant-shift theory can be found here.

(not to be confused with the Great Vowel Movement)
Posted By: BranShea Re: words - 05/01/07 01:21 PM
Thank you for this educational piece of Proto-Indo-European PIE.
I will find time to digest it.
Posted By: zmjezhd Re: saucers, millstones, and the Round Tower - 05/01/07 02:00 PM
Hans Christian Andersen

Yes, it is interesting how many famous linguists have been Danish, e.g., Rasmus Rask (one of the first Indo-Europeanists), Karl Verner (of Verner's Law fame, second only to Grimm's Law), Otto Jespersen (not the present-day comedian), Louis Hjelmslev (of Glossematics fame), and Holger Pedersen (who wrote a great History of 19th century linguistics). Jespersen wrote one of the finest historical grammars of Modern English in 7 volumes (still in print). Another great English grammarian is the Dutch linguist, Hendrik Poutsma, A grammar of late modern English. While, I, like many others, enjoyed the tale of The Emperor's New CLothing, I have always liked The Tinder Box better.
Posted By: of troy Re: saucers, millstones, and the Round Tower - 05/01/07 03:00 PM
Oh me too! i had as a child very few books (that i owned) our entire library in the house was a 3 foot by 3 foot bookcase.
(i always lived in walking distance of excellent libraries and made extensive use)

One book i owned was a collection of HCA fairytales complete with some 16 or so 'color plates' (a term that confused me as a child.. Plate went on the dinner table , these were illustrations!)

i was never read to as child but i learned to read to myself.
the shortest story in the book, The Swineherders Daughter, took 1 page, (and was the first one i read) the last story i read (i was in my teens) was The Snow Queen (it was 30 something pages long)

But i love the tinder box (and remembered when, age 8, in ireland i saw a 'round towers' since that was not a point of reference in my NYC urban life (mill stone weren't much either, but i had been taken to restoration villages, and had at least seen a mill stone)

i don't know what happened to the book (my parents might have it yet) but it was wonderful book
Posted By: BranShea Re: Art Today: The World in Decline - 05/01/07 03:49 PM
Code:
   Myridon
"Talking about art is like dancing about architecture."
- Laurie Anderson quoting Frank Zappa 


Oskar Schlemmer, a leading artist from the Bauhaus movement in Dessau (interbellum) did the dancing about architecture ( made the ballet) and alas, the drawing called 'ambulant architecture'
is not to be found on internet.

Triadische Ballet

It can be done.
Posted By: zmjezhd Re: saucers, millstones, and the Round Tower - 05/02/07 03:53 PM
Oh me too!

I've been trying to remember where I read my first HCA tales. I can remember some of the illustrations, complicated 19th century engraved affairs, but not the book. It may have been a generic reader ... I also had a piece of embroidery that my Danish aunt made for me while I was still in grade school. It pictured HCA's house in Odense and some scenes from 8 or so of his tales.
The HCA tales are more to my liking then the Grimm's tales. Maybe your book had the Arthur Rackham illustrations ? Must be able to find him on WiKip . The Tinder Box. Is that the one with the soldier and the dogs? : one with the eyes as big as saucers, the next with the eyes as big as ? and the third one with eyes as big as ? .
(I forgot)Anyway each one getting bigger (':') (o:o) ( O:O) ?
Posted By: of troy Re: saucers, millstones, and the Round Tower - 05/02/07 07:16 PM
hint, hint, look at top of post and see Heading.
eyes as big as saucers, or millstones, or the round tower.

(i was often told as a child that my eyes were as big as saucers--and sometimes its still true!)
Yes!I was wondering what those words stood for.
I really get smarter by the minute. Thanks for the hint.
Posted By: Jackie Re: saucers, millstones, and the Round Tower - 05/03/07 01:48 AM
I really get smarter by the minute. ...and by the hour (millstone) , and by the day (Round Tower) ...
Hey! you forgot the saucers! You getting smarter too?
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