Why was curried favour made with chestnuts originally?
Why is Doctor Who fighting the encyclopaedia?
And why is Batman a bastard?
Answers on a post, card.
Furst prize: a teddy bare
Second prize: 2
AUGHHHHHHHH, not again! I still haven't gotten over those horses! So, speaking of completely irrelevant:
REGIONAL NOTE When a Southerner favors a relative, he or she is not giving that person special privileges; rather, the Southerner looks like that relative. Favor can be either transitive—She favors her father—or intransitive with a compound subject: She and her father favor. This sense of favor goes back to early modern English: “This young lord Chamont/Favors my mother” (Ben Jonson). The verb derives from the noun favor, which was used from the 15th to the 19th century to mean “appearance, aspect; the countenance, face”: “What makes thy favor like the bloodless head/Fall'n on the block?” (Tennyson). This sense of the noun is now archaic, but the verb thrives in the English of the Southern United States.
the irish alo use favor that way, jackie, (or did).
i grew up hearing it, but almost never use favor in that sense. (just as i don't ever use the word dear to mean expensive or pricey). but then the irish (as well as americans) have a long history of using word the english think to be archaic (just because they have stopped using them)
my ex husband hated when i used the verb to be, and meant 'leave me alone (to my self)'-- (Leave me be!)- even the beatles use of 'let it be' didn't molify him. he insisted it was an improper use.
... are the same verb in many languages (ger. lassen, port. deixar, e.g.) Maybe one of our resident scholars can affirm whether there used to be a single word in English which then split into the two nuanced forms.
~~~
Edit: Mav's quiz went straight over my head. [whooosh]
And it's a wise child who knows whom he favors.
Why was curried favour made with chestnuts originally?
A currycomb is used to groom a chestnut roan, if you'll pardon the redundance.
Brilliant. One down, two to go...
~ and go on, nuncle, give 'em the etymology, don't just tease :)
>And why is Batman a bastard?
because Ubu said so.
-ron o.
Ta.
Curry fr. ME curreien, AN curreier 'to arrange, curry' fr. VL conredare 'to make ready'. Supposedly, curry favor is from ME currayen favel with favel, fauvel being a fallow colored horse, which was a symbol of deceit, so, to be hypocritical. [Cribbed from the AH dictionary.]
Curry, as in the yummy Indian food, from the kari leaf, Murraya koenigii, (kari is a Tamil or Dravidian word I assume), later transfered to the powder of many spices which is the curry powder of today.
and anyone who has groomed a horse will know of a curry comb.
so... Dr Who, created by Terry Nation....
Well Batman (Bruce Wayne) is an orphan. His parents' deaths at the hands of a mugger are in the very first Batman comic. (If you have a copy, mail to me for safekeeping.) As far as his being a bastard, I dunno.
re:
Supposedly, curry favor is from ME currayen favel with favel, fauvel being a fallow colored horse, which was a symbol of deceit, so, to be hypocritical. and fallow colored as we know from the
fallow thread, is a sort of yellow.
in the middle ages, beggers, lepers, jugglers, and marginalize peoples were required to wear striped clothing--very often yellow stripes.. and the devil in 'plays' was always shown wearing yellow stripes.. yellow has an interesting association with sin and deceit. stripes, and attitudes toward stripes in clothing have changed, but we still have the comic book assocication of prisioners wearing stripes... and stripes (broad, garish stripes) are still used on servants clothing.. (like doormen, or jockies, or McDoDo's employees)
of course, i still don't 'get' why to curry favor is.. has something to do with a chestnut.. (but don't bother trying to explain...)
more on stripes..
http://www.findarticles.com/cf_dls/m1134/10_110/80774396/p1/article.jhtml(or you could read the book..)
A chestnut is a horse that is chestnut colored. Likewise a roan, though they may be of other colors.
A currycomb is used to groom a chestnut roan
Well for heaven's sake, mav--there is no "getting" you: I thought that one was way too obvious for your devious little mind!
Didn't know, or had forgotten, about favel--thanks, jheem.
In reply to:
(just as i don't ever use the word dear to mean expensive or pricey). but then the irish (as well as americans) have a long history of using word the english think to be archaic (just because they have stopped using them)
Actually, I think 'dear' meaning expensive is still alive and well in England. I don't think I would say something was dear (so blunt, these Americans) but I might say "It's a bit on the dear side".
Bingley
"Dear" for "expensive" is not only still common here in Zild, it is easily the most common use for the word. I've often wondered if the similarity between dear and teuer is merely coincidental.
> way too obvious for your devious little mind!
I thang you :)
I was pertickly innerested in this expression because it's an example of a language fossil.
Nope: Batman may be a less specific term than the capitalisation suggests... <eg>
I love the deadjectival form of dear, dearth, along with all its -th cousins.
as in Darth?
Darth didn't bother me as much as Binaka, but, yes, sure, Shrdlu, Ani's yer pop.
Dang it, maverick, that wasn't cricket, 'specting us sophisticated US'n's to get it. (Wish I'd had the time to LIU yesterday, but.)
Batman is a bastard when he sledges? (Note: expect horripilation from the Kiwi contingent.)
http://www.abcofcricket.com/Article_Library/art57/art65/art65.htm
And I thought a batman was an officer's valet.
I've often wondered if the similarity between dear and teuer is merely coincidental.
They are cognate, and deer and Tier are, too.
>Batman is a bastard when he sledges
Well, there is no such thing as a batman in cricket. There are batsmen, but no batmen, as least not that I know of.
As for the comment about Kiwi sledgers, it was followed up by a piece of cricketing irony, or possibly just plain sarcasm, namely, "A leggie doesn’t take a bozillion Test wickets by deceiving people." Deceiving people is, of course, precisely how a good legspinner does take wickets. Although in Warnie's cse, it might be argued that he boored them to death.
And the South African team could Boer them to death.
> And I thought a batman was an officer's valet.
Half way there ~ so whence the reference to 'bat'?
good fun this thread..
BASTARD: Middle English; via Old French from medieval Latin bastardus, probably from bastum ‘packsaddle’; compare with Old French fils de bast, literally ‘packsaddle son’ (i.e. the son of a mule driver who uses a packsaddle for a pillow and is gone by morning)
BATMAN:mid 18th cent. (originally denoting an orderly in charge of the bat horse pack-horse which carried the officer's baggage): from Old French bat (from medieval Latin bastum ‘packsaddle’) + man.
Oh, I cheated all right; straight from the horse's mouth, (my B&M dict) all the above stuff. Am still stumped by my searches for the good Doctor.
Mav, why the comma and space between post and card. Is there something there or is spot the difference getting to me?
Great job, maahey - and research is a Good Thang :)
oh, the comma thing was just a playful way of saying "don't send guesses by PM or the separate answers thread, just post 'em".
Ok, another clue: with Dr Who, think about his adversaries...
Ok, another clue: with Dr Who, think about his adversaries...
Never much got into Dr Who, but I remember he was usually fighting Daleks.
Encyclopedia from Latin from Greek enkuklios paideia 'general education', en 'in' + kuklos 'wheel'
> Daleks
Getting very close... "Exterminate! Exterminate!"
Getting very close... "Exterminate! Exterminate!"
Exterminare 'to drive out' from ex- 'out of' + terminare 'to mark boundaries, set limits' from terminus 'boundary'.
I looked at a Doctor Who FAQ, and discovered that the Daleks were actually aliens in some kind of armor and not robots as I'd thought. They say "exterminate" a lot, but also "obey". Kind of childlike behavior, but what does it have to do with general education?
umm, Daleks, Cybermen, Ice Warriors, Yeti, the Master, what was the name of the fish-type people?
Bingley
what was the name of the fish-type people?Here's a list:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/cult/doctorwho/alien/index.shtml
Ah yes, the Sea Devils, thank you.
Bingley
> what does it have to do with general education?
mebbe I should have hinted "Eks~terminate!" :)
Well, en- is in and eks- is out, and e- in education is short for ex- which is also out as in e + duc + are. Education being a 'leading out of' an initial state of ignorance. Also, since I live in the Gubernator's state, I thought of Herr Schwartzenegger famous role as the Terminator. But I can't see the connection, yet. Now, where did I put that coffee? Never attempt problem solving without caffeine.
The ex-Terminator is Austrian by birth. Was the Austrian govt. of the day particularly virulently against the French Encyclopedists?
Bingley
ah, good tries ~ but no banana, the answer is more linguistic or more cryptic-crossword than this direction of Arnie. Eks-terminate = ends with Eks...
Just to put you out of my misery, here's a link, in celebration of my aquisition of OED2 v.3.1, in which these items caught my eye.
http://dictionary.oed.com/newsletters/2003-12/wordsofchoice.html... but according to this obit, although mentioned very much in passing, the dal~eks story may be apocryphal:
http://www.scifi.com/sfw/issue42/news.html!Guess I'll trust the OED at least until proven wrong!)
Jelly-Baby?
trust the OED
I dunno, mav, a bunch of generalists vs some fanatics in the field? Not to mention that a single volume covering Dal to Lek seems a little unlikely.
I can see where there might be a volume labeled Dal - Ek.
But to my way of thinking, here's reason enough not to trust them
:
Lexicographers don't have ‘favourite’ words .
a volume labeled Dal - Ek
For other reasons, I don't find that much more likely than Dal - Lek. And the OED article says Dal - Lek anyway. No, I'm going with the geeks on this one.
> I'm going with the geeks on this one.
I'm sure you'll be in great company, mighty Fong ;)