Tsuwm's wwftd is "thyrsus" I found a paragraph on Internet with some additional information.
the worthless word for the day is: thyrsus
a staff tipped with a pine cone and twined with ivy,
carried by Bacchus, Dionysian revelers and satyrs
In my hand I bear the thyrsus, tipped with fragrant cones of pine.
-Longellow
[thanx to Fred]
-tsuwm http://members.aol.com/tsuwm/
THYRSUS (quvrsoV), a pole carried by Dionysus, and by Satyrs,
Maenades, and others who engaged in Bacchic festivities and rites (Athen.
xiv. 631, a; Vell. Pat. ii.82). [DIONYSIA, p411a] It was sometimes
terminated by the apple of the pine, or fir-cone (kwnofovroV, Brunck, Anal.
i.421), that tree (peuvkh) being dedicated to Dionysus in consequence of the
use of the turpentine which flowed from it, and also of its cones, in making
wine (Walpole, Mem. on Eur. and As. Turkey, p235). The monuments of
ancient art, however, most commonly exhibit instead of the pine-apple a
bunch of vine or ivy-leaves (Ovid. Met. xi.27, 28; Propert. iii.3.35) with
grapes or berries, arranged into the form of a cone. The following
woodcut, taken from a marble ornament (Mon. Matth. ii. tab.86), shows
the head of a thyrsus composed of the leaves and berries of the ivy, and
surrounded by acanthus-leaves. Very frequently also a white fillet was tied
to the pole just below the head, in the manner represented in the woodcut
on p136b, where each of the figures holds a thyrsus in her hand. See also
the woodcuts to FUNAMBULUS and VANNUS (Statius, Theb. vii.654).
[INSTITA.] The fabulous history of Bacchus relates that he converted the
thyrsi carried by himself and his followers into dangerous weapons, by
concealing an iron point in the head of leaves (Diod. iii.64, iv.4; Macrob.
Sat. i.19). Hence his thyrsus is called "a spear enveloped in vine-leaves"
(Ovid. Met. iii.667), and its point was thought to incite madness (Hor.
Carm. ii.19.8; Ovid. Amor. iii.1.23, iii.15.17, Trist. iv.1.43; Brunck, Anal.
iii.202; Orph. Hymn. xlv.5, 1.8).
thank you very much, Bill, for propagating my misspell of Longfellow for even more folks to see and comment on. but see, my excuse is (and it's my excuse) that I was so obsessed with getting thyrsus right (and getting Bacchus and Dionysian into the same definition) ....
Dear tsuwm: I trust you so implicitly that I do not look for typos in your work. Did you notice how many people copied my typo of "ideolect" for "idiolect"?
>Did you notice how many people copied my typo....
no. do you suppose it was as many as half a hunnert?
The mention in the excerpt above of the pine being sacred to Dionysus because of the turpentine from it reminded me of hearing in a biochem lecture that Roman ladies drank small amounts of turpentine because it gave their urine an odor of lavender. I asked the lecturer:"For whose benefit?" But got no answer.
I looked up the word "Funambulus" in the excerpt above, and found another interesting paragraph.
FUNA˘MBULUS (kalobavthV,
scoinobavthV), a rope-dancer. The art of
dancing on the tight rope was carried to
as great perfection among the Romans
as it is with us (Hor. Epist. ii.1.210;
Terent. Hecyr. Prol 4.34; Juv. iii.80;
Bulenger, de Theat. 1.42). If we may
judge from a series of paintings
discovered in the excavations (Ant.
d'Ercol. T. iii. p160-165), from which
the figures in the annexed woodcut are
selected, the performers placed
themselves in an endless variety of
graceful and sportive attitudes, and
represented the characters of
bacchanals, satyrs, and other imaginary
beings. Three of the persons here exhibited hold the thyrsus, which may
have served for a balancing pole; two are performing on the double pipe,
and one on the lyre: two others are pouring wine into vessels of different
forms. They all have their heads enveloped in skins or caps, probably
intended as a protection in case of falling. The emperor Antoninus, in
consequence of the fall of a boy, caused feather-beds (culcitras) to be laid
under the rope to obviate the danger of such accidents (Capitol. M. Anton.
12). One of the most difficult exploits was running down the rope (Sueton.
Nero, 11) at the conclusion of the performance. It was a strange attempt of
Germanicus and of the emperor Galba to exhibit elephants walking on the
rope (Plin. H.N. viii. 2; Sueton. Galb. 6; Sen. Epist. 86).
Smith's
Dictionary
Would you call that a Satyr day-night special??
Satyr day-night special. Yes, and a concealed weapon too, as the spike was hidden, though they couldn't carry it under toga.
Both interesting etymologies, Dr. Bill! Along with their tidbits of historical info...got a good belly laugh out of your "lavender urine" post!
And after TEd's Satyr day-night special puntification, it suddenly occurred to me that Saturday night, Friday night, etc. could be a bit rendundant. Wouldn't Saturday and Saturnight, Friday and Frinight be more precise and make more sense? What thinkest the board?
He's Monnight in shining armor
Tuesnight, Tuesnight, I'll see my love Tuesnight.
Wednesnight gonna fall?
Thurnight has a thousand eyes.
Frinight? Nope, it's grill night.
and TEd, you already (in effect) noted that weekend carousing occurs on Satyr-night.
(If carried to extremes, would it be a satyr-nalia?)
Sunnight, however, would be an oxymoron.
Hilarious, TEd! I think you get ALL the TEddies with this one!
And, Keiva, wouldn't Sunnight be sunspots?
"lavender urine" Dear WhitmanO'Neill: Almost thirty years ago I saw an ad in Time magazine for flavored vaginal douches. So I asked my foul-mouthed social worker how she thought the market research had been done to determine which flavors were most popular.
Wouldn't Saturday and Saturnight, Friday and Frinight be more precise and make more sense?
We used to do that time back way back. But Sunnight came before and not after Sunday. And the evening and the morning were the first day.
Wai, wai, wait a minute: Saturday night, Friday night, etc. could be a bit redundant
Redundant?
how she thought the market research had been done to determine which flavors were most popular.
Oh, duh! Ask people.
Redundant?
Sure...just try the inversion. Saturnight day, Frinight day, etc. How can day be of night, or night be of day? Okay, Faldage...now I see your point. Poor word choice. Perhaps contradictory would be more accurate.
Perhaps contradictory would be more accurate.
I've always felt that way, too. I had a character I was developing (to no specific end), a temporally transplanted Angle (or Saxon or Jute) from 6th century Engellonde who was struggling to make sense of modern English. He was to have had great difficulties with the concept of Friday night.
yes, but.. A day is 24 hours..not just the daylight hours.. so Friday night, is that part of Friday that is not during daylight hours..
a day is a 24 hour period, daytime-- is that portion of the day that has sunlight, night(time) is the portion with out sun. and for those of us in more northen latitudes, there is dawn and twilight.. fairly short in NY, but a wonderful time further north..eh, bean?
That's true, oftroy...we do say "seven days in a week." It's the official nomenclature for a 24 hour period. So it does include the night thereof. But as Faldage pointed out, it must be very confusing for someone just learning English (along with an endless stream of other linquistic contradictions inherent in the language!).
well that make me think about -- when does a day start?
as faldage pointed out, we used to use the old style, still use by the Jews, that a day ended at sundown, and the you then had Monnight, (sundown to dawn, and Monday, dawn to sunset)
Now we end the day in the middle of the night. How about other cultures? is there anywhere that the day starts at dawn? Monday, followed by Monnight? is suspect not, since i think the old style was something christianity borrowed from the jews, and i suspect moslems did too. but what about cultures that were not exposed to the judeo/christian concepts?
I would run a check of the history of the word through the OED and, perhaps, an Old English Reader/Grammar to see if the modern meaning held much weight back in them days.
In the interest of clarity I think sticking to the current standards makes more sense.
For example it is much clearer to say "I will meet you on Friday at 6:00 p.m. instead of Fridusk" What time would Frinight start?
There are to many different periods in the day that have indistinct start/stop times. I don`t know all of them but you can ask any Jewish person and he will tell you that there is more than just dawn, dusk, morning, noon and night in a day.
Dear TEd: many a chicken that's hot on Frynight gets warmed over on Satyrnight and Sunnight.
Sonnabend Nacht
Now there's the redundancy!
I don't know, but I doubt Germans use Sonnabend more than Samstag, the actual name for Saturday. I figured that Sonnabend was used more for Saturday evening or night, right before Sunday, rather than for the whole day, but I'm not a German expert, by?
In Indonesian hari is the 24 hour period. The days of the week are: Minggu, Senin, Selasa, Rabu, Kamis, Jumaat, Sabtu . Night = malam . If you want to contrast night-time and daytime you can talk about siang hari or malam hari.
Malam Minggu means Saturday evening/night (Sunday eve). Minggu malam means Sunday evening/night.
The day is divided into pagi (sunrise till about 10 a.m.), siang (10 a.m. till 3 p.m.), and sore (about 3 p.m. till sunset). tadi means earlier today so tadi siang= this middle of the day(earlier than now) and nanti means later today so nanti siang this middle of the day(later than now). Tadi malam means last night, so it's felt to be part of today.
Other parts of the day are fajar (dawn,sunrise)(a popular boy's name), magrib (sunset), senja (dusk), lurut malam (late at night).
Bingley
lurut malam Senin; tadi malam ? (The time of my post.)
lurut malam Senin. tadi is in relation to now. So it's Sunday night for you, and Tuesday lunchtime for me, but the now is the same.
Bingley
lurut malam Senin. tadi is in relation to now. So it's Sunday night for you, and Tuesday lunchtime for me, but the now is the same
Terima kasih. Tetapi, lurut malam Senin, untuk saya.
Perhaps my days of the week were not clear:
Minggu Sunday
Senin Monday
Selasa Tuesday
Rabu Wednesday
Kamis Thursday
Jumaat Friday
Sabtu Saturday
Sabtu and Minggu come from Portuguese. I think the others come from Arabic, but I'm not sure. Local, pre-Muslim, calendars had a five-day week.
Bingley
Malam Minggu means Saturday evening/night (Sunday eve). Minggu malam means Sunday evening/night.
lurut malam Senin
So...not knowing how to say "very early Tuesday morning",
I opted for lurut malam Senin, thinking I was saying "very late Monday night". Was I really saying "very late on the eve of Monday"? Should I have said lurat Senin malam?
>many a chicken that's hot on Frynight gets warmed over on Satyrnight and Sunnight.
MY chicken stays hot all weekend!
"MY chicken stays hot all weekend!" Ted, does your wife agree??
Church's Chicken serves on everyday, not just Sunday.
In the South, every night is Frynight. Saturnight follows as in 'sat her right on down on the pot after eating too much on Frynight'.
BelMarduk notes the different periods in a day. For better than 1500 years, Europeans observed some form of the canonical hours, the system used in monasteries, which had 3-hour periods, with the monks gathering in the chapel to chant the appropriate office for each. These were:
Matins: at midnight
Lauds: 3 a.m.
Prime: daybreak or 6 a.m.
Tierce: 3 hours after Prime, or 9 a.m.
Sext: noon
Nones: 3 hours after Sext, or 3 p.m.
Vespers: sunset, or 6 p.m.
Compline: 3 hours after Vespers, or 9 p.m.
The names for the daytime hours show that they are the first, third, sixth and ninth hours of the day. (Which is how you know what the King James Version of the Bible is talking about when it mentions "the sixth hour" or "the ninth hour".)
Towards the end of the Middle Ages, in many monasteries, some of these were combined, like Matins and Lauds, sung at midnight, and Vespers and Compline sometime between sunset and the hour for retiring. Also Tierce might be conjoined right after Prime, and Nones right after Sext. So that by the time of the Reformation many communities had Matins/Lauds at midnight, Prime/Tierce at daybreak or 6 a.m., Sext/Nones at noon, Vespers/Compline around sunset or somewhere between 6 and 8 pm.
Fractions of these periods were called in the German fashion (where halb sechs is 5:30 or halfway to six), such as half nones = 1:30 p.m. or thereabouts, or halfway from sext to nones.
In reply to:
I opted for lurut malam Senin, thinking I was saying "very late Monday night". Was I really saying "very late on the eve of Monday"? Should I have said lurat Senin malam?
Late Monday night would be lurut Senin malam or lurut malam Selasa. You could probably say pagi-pagi hari Selasa. The day starting at midnight is one of those things the language hasn't really caught up with yet.
Bingley