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Posted By: guest if given a choice... - 04/04/03 04:26 PM
is there a term for a situation where a person is given an ostensibly equal choice between two alternatives but if the person is unable or unwilling to make a decision, the decision defaults to one or the other? a simple example would be if someone were at a train station, trying to decide whether to hop on and head to a destination or remain in town. if the train leaves before the person has made the choice, then the decision has been effected for him without any proactive effort on his part.

the opposite would be a choice such as whether to order one meal or another, and hesitating so long as to cause the waiter to slip away without anything having been ordered; in this case there is no forced decision.

i'm not speaking of hobson's choice; my query doesn't necessarily refer only to when neither choice is palatable, although it could encompass that scenario as well.


Posted By: wwh Re: if given a choice... - 04/04/03 04:54 PM
The word "dilemmma" is used for a situtation where a difficult choice must be made. Not sure it fits your requirements.


Posted By: Wordwind Re: if given a choice... - 04/04/03 05:13 PM
[smart aleck comment coming; disregard if you're not in the mood]

Dilemmma, wwh? Is that the situation in which you have three choices, none of which has a desirable outcommme?

Posted By: wwh Re: if given a choice... - 04/04/03 05:40 PM
Dear WW: Easy. Trilemma. Not even my coinage. Lots of sites using it.
But I haven't found a good adjective to go with "dilemma"
to indicate it being self-limiting. "Fugax" means of very short duration, but I'm not sure of gender agreement.

Posted By: Wordwind Re: trilemma - 04/04/03 06:16 PM
1. (Logic) A syllogism with three conditional propositions, the major premises of which are disjunctively affirmed in the minor. See Dilemma.~Dictionary.com "Disjunctively affirmed in the minor"--what the hell does that mean?

Sorry, Guest, that we haven't found the term for which you're looking. Somebody here will hit upon it eventually.

Posted By: wwh Re: if given a choice... - 04/04/03 06:16 PM
While trying to think of a word or phrase that would fit our welcome "guest" 's request, I encountered in spellingbee list
word "holophrastic" defined as "expressing a complex of ideas in a single word". T think the example the Scripps-Howard people gave is very dubious:
"Holophrastic utternaces are one of the first stages in childrens's acquistion of speech."

Let's get back to "guest"'s request. Ephemeral means of short duration, but not short enough. He wants "Take it or leave it" in one word if possible. I think it will have to be a short phrase.

Posted By: Wordwind Re: trilemma<tetralemma - 04/04/03 06:51 PM
Just for the record:

tetralemma quandary with four alternatives

Posted By: maahey Re: if given a choice... - 04/04/03 07:01 PM
Hello Guest!!
a situation where a person is given an ostensibly equal choice between two alternatives but if the person is unable or unwilling to make a decision

At home, such a state or a person in this state, is called, A Hamlet.

Apart from our Shakespearean liberties, I like both wwh's dilemma and WW's quandary. Both these words seem apt for the state such as you describe.



Posted By: Wordwind Re: if given a choice... - 04/04/03 07:14 PM
I don't think dilemma works exactly since outcomes of a dilemma are supposedly unwanted. Guest seems to be posing that situation in which it's not so much the choices that are the problem, but the chooser who has the problem. The chooser could be in a quandary, but I don't think the chooser necessarily has a dilemma before him since the choices could both have agreeable outcomes.

Guest, could you expound a bit further?

Posted By: of troy Re: if given a choice... - 04/04/03 09:46 PM
I would say they made a decision by default...

in the train example, if they do nothing, (that is they don't get on the train) the default is staying in town...

and if they were on the train, and thinking about getting off a stop before their normal station to go shopping, or to visist a friend, and let the train stop, and didn't get off, again the decision is one of default... they did nothing to change the status....

lots of decisions are made by default... people are often dissatisfied with their job, or their spouse, or their homes or apartments... but changing requires them to do something, to make some sort of effort... they decide not to make any special effort and nothing changes...

sometimes they get divorced by default... if one spouse wants a change,and starts divorce proceeding, and the other doesn't take any action, they are likely to find themselved divorced--by default.



Posted By: consuelo Re: if given a choice... - 04/05/03 02:45 AM
The divorce is often default of the one who makes no effort to stop it, isn't it?

Posted By: maahey Re: if given a choice... - 04/05/03 03:24 AM
then the decision has been effected for him without any proactive effort on his part.

Was in a rush when I posted earlier on, and it is only on re-reading the original query, I now realise, that Guest's poser is directed at a situation where the outcome is decided by the lack of action on the part of the 'Hamlet'.

In a situation such as this, (the train e.g.,) where an outcome is inevitable, procrastination would result in, 'a fait accompli'. ..?

Posted By: RubyRed Re: if given a choice... - 04/05/03 07:49 AM
I don't know of a definitive term for what you are asking, Guest. What I do in the absence of an allusive term or phrase, is to rework the sentence or paragraph until I have a satisfactory description of what I'm trying to convey.

In your instance of wanting to convey decision by default, I would write something like: Unable to make a commitment to either choice, he relinquished his decision to fate.

Posted By: Bingley Re: if given a choice... - 04/05/03 08:57 AM
In reply to:

I encountered in spellingbee list
word "holophrastic" defined as "expressing a complex of ideas in a single word". T think the example the Scripps-Howard people gave is very dubious:
"Holophrastic utternaces are one of the first stages in childrens's acquistion of speech."


I think it's the definition of holophrastic that is at fault, Dr. Bill, because holophrastic is generally used in linguistics to describe the way children just over a year old use single words like "Gone" rather than complete sentences.

Bingley

Posted By: Bingley Re: trilemma - 04/05/03 09:20 AM
In reply to:

1. (Logic) A syllogism with three conditional propositions, the major premises of which are disjunctively affirmed in the minor. See Dilemma.~Dictionary.com "Disjunctively affirmed in the minor"--what the hell does that mean?


Major premise: If A is true, then B is true.
Minor premise: A is true
Conclusion: Therefore B is true.

Example:
Major premise:All animals with trunks are elephants (i.e. if an animal has a trunk it is an elephant)
Minor premise: This animal has a trunk
Conclusion: Therefore this animal is an elephant.

I think what they're getting at, WW, would be something like
Major premises:
If A is true Z is true.
If B is true Z is true.
If C is true Z is true.
Minor premise:
Either A is true or B is true or C is true.
Conclusion:
Therefore Z is true.

Can't think of an example, sorry.

Bingley

Posted By: Faldage Re: trilemma - 04/05/03 12:39 PM
If A is true Z is true.
If B is true Z is true.
If C is true Z is true.
Minor premise:
Either A is true or B is true or C is true.


If you flip the wall switch down, the room will get dark.
If the light bulb blows, the room will get dark.
If the main power is lost, the room will get dark.
.
.
.


Now, on to the main question. Dilemma is the fork in the road. In a fait accompli the bridge that comes after the right hand fork is already down. Guest is looking for the word that covers the situation where the bridge goes down after the person gets to the fork in the road but hasn't yet decided which road to go down. I don't know a single word for that, but would use the phrase "not to choose is to choose" to describe it.

Posted By: guest Re: trilemma - 04/12/03 02:09 PM
a collective thanks for the replies.

oftroy, "default" was probably the word i was searching for ~ thank you!

faldage, your phrase "not to choose is to choose" perfectly describes the situation which catalyzed my query. i like it better than "fate" in that it clearly conveys responsibility on the part of the 'chooser' (who in this case chose by not choosing) for the outcome.

Posted By: wow Re: hello Guest! - 04/13/03 02:33 PM
Welcome Guest!
Coming late to discussion but doesn't procratination come into play here somewhere?
And Consuelo "default of the one who makes no effort"
Have you been writing the headers for segments of "Frasier?"
Honestly, I am gone for a couple of months ......

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