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Posted By: stales Have A Go - 10/14/01 03:20 PM
I don't even know how to spell the word in question, but where does the slang term "burl" come from when it is used instead of go or turn.

eg:

"Stales, it's your turn to make a post"

(replies) "Righto, I'll give it a burl"

stales

Posted By: of troy Re: Have A Go - 10/14/01 03:48 PM
) "Righto, I'll give it a burl"
definately some sort of ozzie slang.. Here in US, we'd
Give it a whirl if we wanted to take a turn or try at something.



Posted By: Keiva Re: Have A Go - 10/14/01 04:01 PM
Agreed, Helen. Never heard of "give it a burl" (stales, are you pulling our collective legs?), but "give it a whirl" is well known. (pop song from the 60's, "C'on, baby let's give it a whirl / I wanna know if you'll be my girl." Title was "Hey, baby" [such wonderful writing, no?]; can't recall the singer.)

Posted By: wow Re: Have A Go - 10/14/01 06:19 PM
And there's "give it a go" for a difficult task.

But "burl?" What's going on down there at the top of the world? Blood rushing to your head?

Later Ah-HA! Tried burl in OED and it gave reference to birl and birl means a spin, a twist, a whirl, a try, an attempt esp in writing!
Another entry gave it as "a knot" so that ties in with a dificult task.

Trumpets!
Posted By: Capital Kiwi Re: Have A Go - 10/14/01 07:25 PM
Yep, I could have given you this one had I checked the Board earlier, Stales. And no, it's not a leg-pull you doubting Thomases and Thomasinas. It's the straight poop.

Posted By: wofahulicodoc Re: Have A Go - 10/14/01 10:49 PM


Subject: birl

I've always thought of birling as what lumberjacks do on a log -- they have "birling contests" at which two of them stand at opposite ends of the same log and each tries to get each other to lose his balance (hopelessly chauvinistic and out of date, but then I don't know of too many in-the-water lumberjills) (neologism but it seems like the right appellation) by spinning the log aggressively. Yes? Are there other uses?


Posted By: stales Re: Have A Go - 10/14/01 11:19 PM
WOW WOW (again)

Now that the fanfare has ceased ringing around the halls....

Thanks for that - at least we now have the spelling down pat. However, was there any reference to whether birl was slang, OzEnglish or whatever? Anything else on the etymology? It's a strange word.

I gotta start doing a few more serious posts....too many aren't taking me seriously.

stales

Posted By: Bobyoungbalt Birling - 10/15/01 02:11 AM
The lumberjacks' birling contests are no more outre or antiquated than those Scottish contests where big hefty guys heave telephone poles around (I believe they call them cabers or something like that); moreover, they do it while wearing a skirt!

Posted By: Jackie Re: Have A Go - 10/15/01 02:17 AM
stales, a long time ago I bookmarked an Aussie slang dictionary, and it's in there as burl.

http://www.geocities.com/Heartland/Plains/9740/slang3.html#O

Posted By: stales Re: Have A Go - 10/15/01 04:03 AM
Jackie

So what you're saying is that we're back where we started? Anybody else got any ideas? (pleading emoticon) I'm tempted by the Canadian application however. Do lumberpeople say that they are going to have a birl? If so, I think we've got a strong contender for the word's etymology.

BTW - thoroughly enjoyed the OzSpeak site - some of the phrases are beauties....."as flash as a rat with a gold tooth". Hehehehehe

The probable misspelling of "birl" (as "burl") reminds me of "burd" - which, I believe is the correct spelling of a word for "young woman". The slang of the 70's taught us all that it is spelt "bird".

stales

Posted By: stales Re: Have A Go - 10/15/01 04:57 AM
Got it!! (I think)

The word "whirl" can be substituted for "birl" - ie, "C'mon stales, give it a whirl". Following the thought further, it's only a very small step to thinking of taking one's turn as taking one's chance (in trying to do something). Ergo, we are now considering whirling and birling in the context of a game of chance. Thus, surpise surprise, the expression may have had its origin in the famous Oz game of 2-up (which, as I'm sure you are all aware of, 2 pennies are spun in the air and the outcomes bet upon - 2 heads, 2 tails or a split). The person that flips the coins, the spinner, is giving the pennies a birl. As the spinner's role can be filled by any of the assembled punters, each could say, "I'll give it a birl" as they stepped into the circle.

Another game of chance contender is the "chocolate wheel" - that firm favourite of pubs, school fetes, returned serviceman's ("RSL") clubs etc. You know, the big wooden disk with nails around its perimeter against which a strip of rubber flaps.

Whaddya reckon? I think the "twirl" definition DID crack it - big thanks.

stales

Posted By: tsuwm Re: Have A Go - 10/15/01 05:03 AM
stales, it may be that we have two phrases (i.e., give it a burl/whirl) linked by coincidence (or not). the folks at OED don't seem to have made a direct connection, for they give us:

burl n. [App. var. north. dial. birl a whirring sound, a rapid twist or turn, etc. (see E.D.D. and Sc. Nat. Dict.); cf. birl v. to revolve, rotate.] 1. ? Roundness, fullness. poet.
2. Also birl. An attempt, a try, a test; esp. in phr. to give it a burl, to make an attempt. Austral. and N.Z. colloq.

birl v. Scot. [A modern word: apparently onomatopœic; having probably association with birr, whirr, whirl, hurl, and Sc. dirl, pirl, in all of which there is a reference to vibration or rotation and its sound.]
1. intr. To move on with rotatory motion, as a rifle bullet; also fig.
2. To revolve or rotate rapidly and with characteristic noise.

the vbl n. birling would seem to fall out of the lattermost sense.

-joe (I'm a lumberjack and I'm okay) friday

Posted By: Jackie Stream-of-consciousness - 10/15/01 11:08 AM
Whirl, burl; whirly-burly; hurly-burly...hurdy-gurdy(?).
============================================================

tsuwm: you dress in women's clothing??? Well, that's ok...I guess...

Posted By: Keiva Re: Have A Go - 10/15/01 03:12 PM
Helen: >definitely some sort of ozzie slang..
OED: >esp. in phr. to give it a burl, to make an attempt. Austral. and N.Z. colloq.

Nicely done, Helen!

Posted By: of troy Re: Have A Go - 10/15/01 03:53 PM
Keiva, even a stopped clock gets to right twice a day!

Posted By: Keiva Re: Have A Go - 10/15/01 04:37 PM
even a stopped clock
Still, I have to hand it to you, Helen, for chiming in on this one!

Posted By: TEd Remington chocolate wheel - 10/15/01 04:54 PM
Here in the US these are seen at carnivals, where they are called dice wheels.

They are used in Kentucky for determining when to wean horses. Basically, adult horses run faster if they are weaned sooner. Hence the expression "A foal and her mummy are soon parted."

Posted By: Capital Kiwi Re: chocolate wheel - 10/16/01 10:45 PM
TEd, do you have a licence or something? And does it cost much? Where do you get them? Time they put the fees up, I think!

Posted By: belMarduk Have a go - 10/17/01 01:04 AM
So we have:

Have a go = give it a birl = give it a whirl

What about "take a stab at it," which means the same thing but seems a tad more, um, rough. Does anybody have an idea as to origin of this particular variation?

Posted By: doc_comfort Re: Have a go - 10/17/01 01:14 AM
One of my favourite blackadder sequences...
From http://www.totse.com/en/ego/science_fiction/ba2-2.html
E = Edmund Blackadder
C = a young crone

E: Tell me young crone, is this Putney?
C: That it be, that it be.
E: "Yes it is". Not "that it be". You don't have to talk in that stupid voice to me. I'm not a tourist. I seek information about a Wisewoman.
C: Ah, the Wisewoman.. the Wisewoman.
E: Yes, the Wisewoman.
C: Two things, my lord, must thee know of the Wisewoman. First, she is ... a woman, and second, she is ...
E: .. wise?
C: You do know her then?
E: No, just a wild stab in the dark which is incidentally what you'll be getting if you don't start being a bit more helpful. Do you know where she lives?
C: Of course.
E: Where?
C: Here. Do you have an appointment?
E: No.
C: Well, you can go in anyway.
E: Thank you young crone. Here is a purse of money ... which I'm not going to give to you.

And yes, I do realise this doesn't answer the question.

Posted By: Wordwind Post deleted by Wordwind - 10/17/01 09:15 AM
Posted By: TEd Remington Chocolate wheel redux - 10/17/01 04:50 PM
A chocolate wheel is a game in which you put up a small wager and spin the wheel, hoping to win a major prize. I am assuming that the mainstay prize is a chocolate candy that would have much lesser value than the wager.

Vanna

Posted By: stales Re: Have A Go - 10/21/01 12:40 PM
Keiva

Nice of you to be nice to Helen - but the whole point of the post was where does this piece of Ozzie slang come from?

I now suspect that it's all to do with birling/burling = spinning and thus a reference to taking a chance.

stales

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