I used to work in a place where we referred to the boss as our Philosopher King: full of great ideas, all totally unworkable or impractical with the tools at hand.

In the American Civil War (1861-1865), the word 'boss' used as an adjective mean good, great, the best.

I remember it's being used that way in the 1960s, too!

I was a child on a Wisconsin dairy farm. To called the milk cows from the lower pasture we would stand outside the barn, cup our hands around our mouths and shout "ca-baaaaaas!" It worked every time.

you'll also find a boss on a gong.

I beleive the use of boss for cow or calf in English probably goes back to the Ancient Greek bous for ox. A modern farmer and a farmer in ancient Greece would be able to call each others cattle, and the cattle would respond.

the use of boss for cow or calf in English probably goes back to the Ancient Greek bous for ox

Latin bōs, bovis, Classical Greek βους (bous, /'bo:s/) (Modern Greek βους (bous, /'vus/)), English cow, kine, Old English cy, Sanskrit go (gaus) 'ox' are all from PIE *gwou- 'ox, bull, cow'.

English boss is usually thought to be from Latin bōs. Note that the phonologies of Classical and Modern Greek are different.

zmj, this is the part of Linguistics/philology that I just haven't grasped (and I suppose it's not easy to grasp at an amateur level) - e.g., how do you deny a connection between bossy and bovis on the one hand and yet make PIE connections that are so non-obvious (ox, bull, cow)?

One of fictional detective Gideon Fell's favorite expressions when exasperated was "Archons of Athens!" I always wondered what an Archon was. Now I know!

how do you deny a connection between bossy and bovis on the one hand and yet make PIE connections that are so non-obvious (ox, bull, cow)?

I don't think I denied a connection between English boss(y) and Latin bōs. (In fact, I stated that some think that boss(y) was borrowed directly from Latin bōs.) I was implying that English boss(y) did not go back to Ancient Greek bous. (If anything, the two words are cousins of a sort, because they all go back to PIE *gwous.) If Early Modern English boss(y) could be tracked back to Classical Greek, you would have to explain why you were redrawing the family tree of IE languages. How was it that Greeks migrated to the area around present-day Jutland and how their speech was transformed from something quite different than surrounding Germanic languages into something that does not look like Greek, but remarkably looks like those same Germanic languages. Then you have to explain how Old English cy, which is related to Greek bous, came to be, while boss didn't go through some similar sound change. By this time you've pretty much left linguistics, lexicography, and etymology far behind and travelled to a foreign land. Perhaps I don't understand your statement.

Okay, zmj, first I misunderstood what you were saying, and then I misstated what I was trying to ask — gaah; but I'll still never follow all those PIE connections!

but I'll still never follow all those PIE connections!

Do you mean you don't follow how gaus, cow, bos, and bous could all be related to one another and how the word they came from was something like reconstructed *gwos? Or, do you not see how Sanskrit, English, Latin, and Greek are all related to one another, though not one of them is descended from another?

and don't forget ox and bull!



that's the bigger question, isn't it, and the answer(s) seems to be loaded with suppositions.

and don't forget ox and bull!

Are you saying that ox and bull are descended from PIE *gwos? English ox is usually considered to be from PIE *uks-en- 'bull, ox'. Bull is from *bhel- 'to blow, swell'.

Or, are you questioning the semantics of the root *gwos? Historical linguists are doing two things when they reconstruct hypothetical PIE roots: first, the try for the sound of the word, and then, they try for a meaning. Etymological dictionaries use these two constructs without much commentary, but if you look at the literature, you'll see that what the roots (and meanings) are are a kind of shorthand for a bunch of data and ruminations on same. What is problematic with positing that a word for one age and sex of a cow may change over the six or thousand years between PIE and English (or one of the other IE languages)? Words change in pronunciation and meaning all the time.

uh uh. you suggested it..

you suggested it..

Hmm. That's strange. I suggested nothing of the sort. I did say that the four words in the four different languages were from the reconstructed PIE *gwou- root. That root is glossed (or has the meanings) 'ox, bull, cow'. That's why I (rather consistently) put the lemma in italics and the gloss(es) in apostrophes (well, technically in foot signs). Sorry for the confusion.

A boss is also the keystone where two arches intersect.

A boss is also the keystone where two arches intersect.

Ah, yes, and a boss is also a guy what runs fings.

Then this definition may a.o. refer to this:

boss:
5. Ornament consisting of a circular rounded protuberance (as on a vault or shield or belt).

I was wondering what the definition meant till I looked at those pictures of the gongs.
Shield and gong have similar shapes more or less.With the gong it may also have a sound function?

And 'vault ' could refer to Zed's definition?

> With the gong it may also have a sound function?

definitely does. gongs without them are called tam-tams. they have a different tone.