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Posted By: of troy Seeing RED - 05/26/03 01:15 PM
Color
From Bartleby's:

http://www.bartleby.com/61/85/C0488500.html
1. That aspect of things that is caused by differing qualities of the light reflected or emitted by them, definable in terms of the observer or of the light, as: a. The appearance of objects or light sources described in terms of the individual's perception of them, involving hue, lightness, and saturation for objects and hue, brightness, and saturation for light sources. b. The characteristics of light by which the individual is made aware of objects or light sources through the receptors of the eye, described in terms of dominant wavelength, luminance, and purity. 2. A substance, such as a dye, pigment, or paint, that imparts a hue. 3a. The general appearance of the skin; complexion. b. A ruddy complexion. c. A reddening of the face; a blush. 4. The skin pigmentation of a person not categorized as white. 5. colors A flag or banner, as of a country or military unit. 6. colors The salute made during the ceremony of raising or lowering a flag. 7. colors A distinguishing symbol, badge, ribbon, or mark: the colors of a college. 8. colors One's opinion or position: Stick to your colors. 9. Character or nature. Often used in the plural: revealed their true colors. 10a. Outward appearance, often deceptive: a tale with the merest color of truth. b. Appearance of authenticity: testimony that lends color to an otherwise absurd notion. 11a. Variety of expression. b. Vivid, picturesque detail: a story with a lot of color in it. 12. Traits of personality or behavior that attract interest. 13. The use or effect of pigment in painting, as distinct from form. 14. Music Quality of tone or timbre. 15. Law A mere semblance of legal right. 16. A particle or bit of gold found in auriferous gravel or sand. 17. Physics A quantum characteristic of quarks that determines their role in the strong interaction.
VERB: Inflected forms: col·ored, col·or·ing, col·ors

TRANSITIVE VERB: 1. To impart color to or change the color of. 2a. To give a distinctive character or quality to; modify. See synonyms at bias. b. To exert an influence on; affect: The war colored the soldier's life. 3a. To misrepresent, especially by distortion or exaggeration: color the facts. b. To gloss over; excuse: a parent who colored the children's lies.
INTRANSITIVE VERB: 1a. To take on color. b. To change color. 2. To become red in the face; blush.

ETYMOLOGY: Middle English colour, from Old French, from Latin color. See kel-1 in Appendix I.


if we follow one path of the Kel-1 root word, it takes on a colorful (but monochromatic) route!

the rest of the week will be the many words in english a that are related- to a single aspect of the word color.

and along the way, there will be some place names.. like Colorado that take their names from the same root..


Posted By: of troy Re: Seeing RED - 05/27/03 12:17 PM
one of the red word english is heir to, is
vermillion..

1. A bright red mercuric sulfide used as a pigment. 2. A vivid red to reddish orange.
ADJECTIVE: Of a vivid red to reddish orange.
To color or dye (something) in the hue vermilion.
ETYMOLOGY: Middle English vermelion, from Old French vermeillon, from vermeil. See vermeil.

IE root:
http://www.bartleby.com/61/roots/IE571.html


The root word, is one we will keep coming back to...
since english has a number of red words with this same root. its really interesting to see how each language started with the same thing, and ended up with something different, and how english got them all!


Posted By: JohnHawaii Re: Seeing RED - 05/27/03 04:43 PM
I've always found it interesting that the Russian word for"beautiful" (kryasivaya) has the word for "red" as its root (kryasnaya). They have always favored that color, even in their politics.

Posted By: Faldage Re: Seeing RED - 05/27/03 04:47 PM
They have always favored that color

The name of Red Square predates the Revolution, I have been led to understand.

Posted By: maahey Re: Seeing RED - 05/27/03 05:18 PM
And the Chinese! Red literally dominates life in Chinese communities all over the world; red and green in some combination but with red dominating. It is a sign of prosperity and the combination is a metaphor for the balance in the universe. I was in Beijing a couple of years back and was astounded by the amount of symbolism that is a part of everyday life in China. It was somewhat unexpected.

I discovered this to be one of many cultural similarities that the Chinese have with the Indians. Red is accorded significance in India too and is associated with aupsiciousness; although it doesn't quite dominate the cultural consciousness like it does with the Chinese.

There is a brilliant red powder that is applied by married Hindu women in northern India, to the scalp, where the hair parts. This is called Sindoor and denotes a married state. As in, only married women wear it in their hair. Tagore translates this word as vermillion in his writings. I am not sure if the *colour is called Sindoor in Hindi or if the *powder is. Anchita?....

Posted By: of troy Re: Seeing RED - 05/27/03 07:13 PM
Re:the *powder

do you mean the lovely red powder that is the basis for the 'dot' that married women wear?

the i don't know the name either, but its made from tummeric, that has been cooked/processed with an alkali.
(i know that thanks to AMHN- an exitibit on 'hinduism, aspects of god'!) the alkali turns the tumeric red!

what is the word for tumeric? (the yellow ocher spice made from the ground roots of a tuber?)

Posted By: anchita Re: Seeing RED - 05/27/03 09:41 PM
The powder is called 'Sindoor'; the color is sometimes referred to as 'sindoori' in Hindi.

Helen, the 'dot' you refer to is called a 'bindi' (from Sanskrit 'bindu' which refers to a point or dot!) The 'bindi' isn't exclusive to the married female, though a red one is usually worn by them -- it has religious and cosmetic implications as well. The material of the 'bindi' can be derived from a variety of sources, turmeric being one of them. Others are 'sindoor' (for married women,) sandalwood paste (usually for religious purposes,) even the black pigment otherwise used as an eyeliner (espcially popular among younger girls/women.) In the present day, of course, one can see 'sticker bindis' made out of plastic, felt etc.

Turmeric is called 'haldi' in Hindi.

Posted By: of troy Re: Seeing RED - 05/28/03 11:03 AM
Another very old word for red--crimson
From Bartleby's:
A deep to vivid purplish red to vivid red.

ETYMOLOGY: Middle English cremesin, from Old Spanish cremesín, Old Italian cremesino or Medieval Latin cremesnus, all from Arabic qirmizy, from qirmiz, kermes insect. See kermes.

ker·mes
PRONUNCIATION: kûrmz
NOUN: A red dyestuff once prepared from the dried bodies of various female scale insects of the genus Kermes.
ETYMOLOGY: French kermès, short for alkermès, from Arabic al-qirmiz, the kermes, probably from Sanskrit kmi-ja-, (red dye) produced by worms. See kwmi- in Appendix I.
IE root of Kermes
http://www.bartleby.com/61/roots/IE261.html


does any one know of any other cognates in other languages?





Posted By: dxb Re: Seeing RED - 05/28/03 11:19 AM
Another word for red with similar origins is carmine:

NOUN: 1. A strong to vivid red. 2. A crimson pigment derived from cochineal.
ADJECTIVE: Strong to vivid red.
ETYMOLOGY: French carmin, from Medieval Latin carminium, probably blend of Arabic qirmiz, kermes; see kermes, and Latin minium, cinnabar.


Posted By: of troy Re: Seeing RED - 05/28/03 11:30 AM
well there is thursday's word! a day early!
i hope friday's stays safe!

but it is interesting that red has been a popular color for so long.. i suspect because it is associated with blood and losing blood meant losing life..

red delicious apples (a so-so apple for taste) still outsells granny smiths, (which is a very attactively shaped apple) i suspect the color has a lot to do with it..
people like smooth red apples.

Posted By: Bean Re: Seeing RED - 05/28/03 01:46 PM
does any one know of any other cognates in other languages?

Yes, Turkish! kirmizi (no dots on any of the i's) No surprise there since it was originally from Arabic, and Turkish and Arabic share a lot of words.

Posted By: dxb Re: Seeing RED - 05/28/03 02:17 PM
I wonder why red, despite all the good things y’all have been saying about its popularity, is used to signify danger.

PS: I'm sorry to have pinched tomorrows word! I guess there's always that danger.

Posted By: tsuwm Re: Seeing RED - 05/28/03 02:41 PM
>associated with blood

sanguine is one of those words which has developed somewhat opposite senses:
1. bloodred
2. bloody; bloodthirsty, murdurous (sanguinary); ruddy
3. having blood as the predominant body humor
4. confident, optimistic

(not exactly opposites, but murdurous and optimistic seem on the further reaches of some sort of scale)

anyway, I suspect that all relates to the popularity of red as a color.

Posted By: Faldage Re: Seeing RED - 05/28/03 02:46 PM
Red is traditonally used to indicate hot as opposed to blue indicating cold. In stars as in flame it works the other way around with red being significantly cooler than blue.

Posted By: AnnaStrophic Re: And back to Seeing RED - 05/28/03 02:56 PM
Can bulls see color? Or is there something else involved?

Posted By: tsuwm Re: And back to Seeing RED - 05/28/03 02:58 PM
>Can bulls see color? Or is there something else involved?

motion. the red of the cape is for the bullfighter--he wouldn't want to lose track of the thing.
-ron o.

Posted By: of troy Re: Seeing RED - 05/29/03 02:26 PM
cinniibar
1. A heavy reddish mercuric sulfide, HgS, that is the principal ore of mercury. 2. Red mercuric sulfide used as a pigment. 3. See vermilion (sense 2).
ETYMOLOGY: Middle English cinabare, from Latin cinnabaris, from Greek kinnabari.


this is also known as chinese red, since it was cinniibar was used to make chinese laquer.

it was also often used by alchemists... you heat the cinniibar, (and drive off the oxigen, and get liguid mercury, which then oxidized back into cinniibar..

it was the 'sublimation of mercury" that was a basis for alchemry, and it lead to many an alchemist getting mercury poisoning-- including Newton!

Posted By: anchita Re: Seeing RED - 05/29/03 03:00 PM
"I wonder why red, despite all the good things y’all have been saying about its popularity, is used to signify danger."

Check this out: http://newton.dep.anl.gov/askasci/gen99/gen99420.htm



Posted By: Capfka Re: Check out this crossthreading .... - 05/29/03 06:52 PM
Red is also considered to be the colour of lust; of lasciviousness, of sexual excess. A woman in red is a loose woman. A woman in red underwear is automatically available. A woman with bright red lipstick is on the ran-tan.

But nothing comes my way ...

Still ... comments?

Posted By: Zed Re: danger - 05/29/03 10:55 PM
Danger makes sense, red is the color of fire, of ( in the words of my niece) "Hot, don't touch."

Posted By: nancyk Re: Check out this crossthreading .... - 05/30/03 12:40 AM
on the ran-tan

I got the meaning contextually but??????????

Posted By: Capfka Ran Tan - 05/30/03 09:43 AM
Dunno, Nancy. Allus been in my vocab ...

Posted By: Faldage Re: Ran Tan - 05/30/03 10:05 AM
Allus been in my vocab

Well, there's a recommendation for you.

Posted By: of troy Re: Seeing RED - 05/30/03 11:09 AM
scarlet

1. A red dye made of the dried and pulverized bodies of female cochineal insects. It is used as a biological stain and as an indicator in acid-base titrations. 2. A vivid red.
ETYMOLOGY: French cochenille, from Spanish cochinilla, cochineal insect, probably from Vulgar Latin *coccinella, from feminine diminutive of Latin coccinus, scarlet, from Greek kokkinos, from kokkos, kermes berry (from its use in making scarlet dye).


the word cochineal is also available, but i have never heard it used except in a scientific term, for a stain.

1. A red dye made of the dried and pulverized bodies of female cochineal insects. It is used as a biological stain and as an indicator in acid-base titrations. 2. A vivid red.

the etymology is the same as scarlet, its just a much short path.

carmine, crismon, scarlet and vermillion, all refer back to insect, (sometimes as kermes, some times as verm (worm))and cinniibar back to a berry that yeilds a similar color! many different paths, and permutaions!

will you ever look at the color red again the same?

Posted By: Capfka Re: Ran Tan - 05/30/03 10:03 PM
Sorry, should have written Ran Tan©

Posted By: TEd Remington Re: Ran Tan - 05/30/03 10:16 PM
We had a "lady" like that in the neighborhood who specialized in mild sM stuff, usually just "spankings." She retired and wrote a book which became a TV series, years ago, "The Adventures of Ran Tan Tanner."

Posted By: nancyk Re: Ran Tan - 05/30/03 10:18 PM
Sorry, should have written Ran Tan©

Well, why didn't you say so? That clears it right up.

Google gives up this gem:

rantan - is a Direct Method module for the determination of heavy atom positions in a macro-molecule structure or to determine a small molecule structure.

Posted By: Jackie Re: Check out this crossthreading .... - 05/31/03 01:23 AM
A woman in red underwear is automatically available.
I would venture to say that if anyone can see that her underwear is red, well, q.e.d.


Posted By: AnnaStrophic Re: Ran Tan - 05/31/03 06:43 PM
rantan - is a Direct Method module for the determination of heavy atom positions in a macro-molecule structure or to determine a small molecule structure.

well, Nancy, that clears it up: of course it's a household word for Mr.Capfka.

Posted By: Capfka Re: Ran Tan - 05/31/03 08:15 PM
You'll keep, Betsy, you'll keep. One dark night I'll sneak into Ithaca, past all the homeland security guff and the local cops and the campus cops, the FBI, the CIA, the NSA, the Dow Jones, the FTSE 100 and the Nikkei, and I'll shortsheet your damned bed!

Posted By: Faldage Re: Ran Tan - 05/31/03 08:52 PM
shortsheet your damned bed

Ha! First ya gots ta find the house. You're not a JW or insurance salesman, are you?

Posted By: Capfka Re: Ran Tan - 05/31/03 10:13 PM
No, although since posting I've realised that since I'm going to Ithaca I'll have to learn demotic Greek. Need to be understood, don't I? Happen to know what "fold a sheet in half" is in demotic Greek, Faldo?

Posted By: consuelo Re: Seeing RED - 06/01/03 06:09 PM
In Spanish, kermesse means a festival, fair or a market day. I think they pinched it from the Dutch, if I understand my dictionary correctly. In Mexico, a red string or thread is used to protect one from "the evil eye". Many native-culture babies can be seen with a red string or thread with a small pouch on the end around their necks.

Posted By: Bean Re: Seeing RED - 06/03/03 02:01 PM
It seems that all the Turkish evil-eye repelling charms that's I've seen are blue and white.

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