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An orbit is when one object in the universe (for example a planet or a star) goes
round another one without touching it.
Is this an idiom? Something about it bothers me. Is it an ellipsis for "an orbit is created when......"?
Is there a better way to say it?
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I think I'd write it more like: An orbit consists of one object in the universe (for example a planet or a star) going round another one without touching it.
Scratch that. An orbit is the path one object in the universe (for example a planet or a star) follows as it goes
round another one without touching it.
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Is there a better way to say it?
Thoreau didn't think so:
"Our truest life is when we are in dreams awake."
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... goes round...
I'd say 'goes around', but.
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Dear Wordminstrel: Glad to see you posting again. I like the Thoreau quote, no problem.
The thing that jars me is " A thing is when".
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Commentary on adjectivals that answer the question, "When did something happen?" (or..."When will it happen," etc.)
Example: "Our trip is in the summer."
"In the summer" here is a prepositional phrase functioning as a adjective modifiying "trip." It's a phrase that indicates time (or: 'when').
In the sentence you quote, wwh, there's a more complex construction. There is an adjective clause that is introduced by the adverb 'when'--and that's completely legal. We might expect subordinate clauses beginning with 'when' to modify a verb, as in:
"Joe moved against the wall when the crowd entered."
In the above, the clause clearly functions as an adverb modifying 'moved.'
In the sentence you posted, the subordinate clause simply functions as a predicate adjective that modifies 'orbit.' Adjective clauses can begin with 'when,' although we probably hear a lot more adverb clauses beginning with 'when.'
Romance is when you're living in a dream world.
Edit: wwh: You make a good point. I want to add that I don't especially like the sentence you pasted, but I think it's grammatical.
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I just want to add one more observation about adjectivals: In some writings about grammar, you will read that adjectival clause markers are: who whom which that where ...but that classic list is incomplete. When reading about descriptive grammar, you'll find mentioning of 'when' as an adjectival clause marker, too, among other subordinate candidates. 
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I think similar objections have been posed, for fifty years at least, regarding "That's why..." Something to do with predicate adverb issues and the verb "to be", as I recall. The preferred (read "correct") construction was "The reason is that..."
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"The reason is that..."
Or either that or "The reason is…", one.
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The problem with prescriptive grammar is it doesn't always reflect the grammar as it's generally spoken. Although in very formal writing prescriptive grammar would be the better choice, I don't think it should always be the end. For example, if I said, "That's why we shouldn't go!" and, if I am generally and easily understood to be speaking a grammatical sentence, then that construction is acceptable.
I wouldn't have any problem with a speaker in a formal situation developing an argument, and pointedly ending it with the construction: "That is why we should not ________________." Now, had it been a formal argument in writing, I'd lean toward "The reason is _________________."
I don't mean to imply that simply because we can describe a grammatical construction, it is therefore acceptable in all situations. I do mean that when constructions are generally used and understood by most of the population, those constructions are acceptable in formal speech and even to some degree in formal writing. For example, consider the split infinitive. I don't think too many people worry these days about splitting it in formal writing as long as the split doesn't sound awkward and, in fact, facilitates the reading of the sentence.
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I ran into an interesting argument for prescriptive grammar in writing (emphasis mine) recently. When one is speaking one can add many meaningful elements non-linguistically, through facial expression, tone of voice, body language, etc., that cannot be used in written language. Therefore it is important that well understood and universal rules be followed to ensure proper communication.
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And I generally agree, Faldage. But, if you know the rules and if you're sensitive to how the language is spoken and understood, you can break them for rhetorical effect.
Also, some of the rules need to be occasionally questioned if they consistently plug up the plumbing.
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...by entering:
*is when*
Just thought the number of hits was interesting.
Important Edit:I just learned something important about Googling. In the search above, I entered this exactly:
*is when*
...in an attempt to find every listing that included 'is when'--but what I didn't do was to put 'is when' in quotes. Therefore my hits were way off--I looked through the sites and found 'is' and 'when' often split up.
So, here's a correction. By entering:
*"is when"*
...you only get 1,990,000 hits.
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How many hits do you get when you enter "occurs when"? (which is what I would have used in Bill's sentence in the original post)
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Forgive me MG, but what I object to is " a thing is when". For the original sentence, I would
have written: "An orbit is the path........."
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Fair enough, Nunkle Bill! No forgiveness needed....Your sentence is better than mine, streets better.
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Definitions using "is when" are schoolbook examples of "primitive" or "infantile" talk over here. Literacy is when one avoids them  .
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In reply to:
Definitions using "is when" are schoolbook examples of "primitive" or "infantile" talk over here.
And there's a lot that can be said in support of that point of view, wsieber. Yet, when wordminstrel quotes Thoreau, as I've pasted below, the quote doesn't sound either primitive or infantile to my ear. And I do wonder how many other instances exist of great writers having used the "is when" construction? It would be an interesting treasure hunt had I the time and inclincation to undertake such a search:
Thoreau didn't think so:
"Our truest life is when we are in dreams awake."~wordminstrel's observation and quote of Thoreau
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Thoreau wasn't so much defining [o]ur truest life as he was describing when it was made manifest.
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I agree with Faldage here: it's not wrong to use is when when you're actually talking about a time! Maybe if you can flip it around into a sensible question-and-answer pair it's OK:
When is our truest life? It's when we are in dreams awake.
as opposed to
When is an orbit? It's when one object in the universe (for example a planet or a star) goes
round another one without touching it.
The second one should be what is an orbit!!!! Hence you cannot use when in the original version either. Well, you can, but it is informal and - well, maybe infantile* is a bit harsh - to use it to precede a definition which has nothing to do with time.
* But little kids speak like this all the time, so infantile is probably correct.
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