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#9696 11/03/00 02:27 PM
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...I can't do it!

Yeah, sorry folks - this ain't going to work. I have to do a piscine enantiodroma and go back on myself (very easy in a goldfish bowl).

The problem is that if we are "policing" ourselves - which as I've said before is the only way any guidelines are going to work - we have to evaluate all potential postings before submission. Fine to some extent, but because we are intelligent, sensitive people (or in my case, aspire to be ), and because we care about this Board, the tendency is to be too critical. This is an inhibiting influence, which shouldn't really have a home amongst a bunch of free-thinking individualists (replace with label of your choice).

If Questions and Answers were to be committed to 'fact, fact, fact' (exaggeration for effect), I for one wouldn't visit it very often. I may thus miss out on something very interesting, and someone else may miss out on something useful I had to say. You never know.

On a more positive note, here's what I think we could do:

1. Before starting a new thread we could try to do a quick search to check that the subject hasn't - as far as we can tell - been discussed at length before, and if we still feel like we have something to add, we resurrect that thread by posting to it.

2. We could pick reasonably meaningful titles for threads that we start.

3. At the point that a given thread has clearly diverged from its original tack, it's hardly any effort at all to change the Subject of a new posting to something more appropriate and meaningful. Or just something different, as that marks out a 'sub-thread' and potential spin-off.

4. If a given thread takes an eternity to load up (I suppose when viewed in threaded mode), it can be checked for active sub-threads. If one of these has generated a bit of interest, but (hopefully) hasn't run out of steam, we can start up a dedicated new thread, possibly with an internal link from the old. The link is rarely essential, mind.

BUT
..all of the above can only be recommendations. To that extent, there's going to be a lot that slips through the net, and that we just have to live with.

I'm sure we can cope.


Fisk

P.S. "RealWorld" commitments are going to slow me down considerably for the next couple of weeks, and I've dropped a gear anyway. So Bingley, Marty - you won't be alone in needing to catch up with what gems have been unearthed in your absence. We're obliged to skim-read, so we're bound to miss some stuff. But never mind.

P.P.S. Sorry JazzO... mega-long post.





#9697 11/03/00 03:51 PM
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>what's wrong with Fred, anyway??

nothing, if you get the joke -- but then if you get the joke....

isn't part of this whole discussion an attempt to make this place less inaccessible? I think 'Fred' falls into the same category as YART (mea culpa) as being the sort of thing that once seemed clever but now just adds to the "elitist" feeling. IMO.


#9698 11/03/00 04:10 PM
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evaluate all potential postings before submission

I think your post is mostly very sensible commentary too fisk. But I do disagree with your revervations about the highlighted bit above! I think we do, all have to just exercise a little more restraint, or many will drop out altogether. That's the central point I come back to.

But tsuwm, we all love the word YART - it's got such a lovely noise to it, so expressive! I think we just have to make sure terms like this are not used as an offensive weapon - mastering the cant, after all, is the oldest and surest way to becoming a member of any club.


#9699 11/03/00 07:41 PM
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But tsuwm, we all love the word YART - it's got such a lovely noise to it, so expressive!

I have to agree that it's a word that fills a hole where previously there was no common word to describe such a situation, but if everyone is going to understand it we're all just going to have to buckle down and use it in our everyday lives until it turns up in Webster's.


#9700 11/03/00 08:58 PM
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I don't know that we all love the word YART. In fact, I can think of two people who decidedly dislike the word.


#9701 11/03/00 09:53 PM
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> decidedly dislike the word.

okay, here's the crux: do you dislike the word, or having it pointed out that this is Yet Another Rehashed Topic?
stay tuned for rule #7-B to follow...


#9702 11/03/00 09:58 PM
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Jo sent me a link to a strange FAQ regarding Godwin's Law, which I won't go into here (it doesn't seem germane to our situation); but it does reference "UseNet Rules", some of which seem to resonate:

Rule #nonumber: There are no hard-and-fast Rules on UseNet, only Guidelines, which are more or less strictly enforced (and differ) from group to group; this is why it's generally wise to read any group for a bit before ever
posting to it.
Rule #17: Go not to UseNet for counsel, for they will say both `No' and `Yes' and `Try another newsgroup'.
Rule #2: "The Net interprets censorship as damage and routes around it."
Rule #7-B: There is no topic so thoroughly covered that noone will ever bring it up again.
Rule #90120: Applying your standards to someone else's post *will* result in a flamewar.
Rule #1: Spellling and grammer counts.[sic] So do grace, wit, and a sense of humor (the latter two are different), as well as a willingness to meet odd people, but these are lesser considerations.
Rule #x^2: FAQs are asked frequently. Get used to them.
Rule #29: no rational discourse can happen in a thread cross-posted to more than two newsgroups.
Rule #547: When people know they're wrong they resort to ad hominems.
Rule #37: Read the thread from the beginning, or else.
Rule #5: Nobody ever ignores what they should ignore on Usenet.
Rule #3: For every opinion there is at least one equally loud and opposing opinion; sometimes stated as:
Rule #27: "In cyberspace, *everyone* can hear you scream."




#9703 11/03/00 10:22 PM
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#9704 11/03/00 11:04 PM
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I am a bundle of likes and dislikes, like any human.

I'm sure it shouldn't matter to anyone else that I don't like acronyms, in particular the word "YART". I'm sure that other people don't like some of the words I use (like orientated - Jackie, or all those extra letters in words - Anna). To be really trivial it may be a simple as the word re-hashed sounding like something kind of stew that has been on a plate, thrown back into the pan and served up again, probably relates to my mother's cooking, think about something Baldrick would have made in Blackadder and you'll get my drift. I can't think that any of our conversations are as bad as that. I did mind when it became a bit too commonly used and I feared that it might put people off posting but I think that has all calmed down now.

Another word that doesn't do anything for me is "gutter", my first thought when I hear the word gutter is the pipe which goes round the bottom of a roof before it takes the water down the drainpipe, and I always wonder why people would want to be hanging off the side of a roof, so it doesn't fit the most common usage here ... but I wouldn't be so churlish as to spoil the fun.

I do dislike people "nitpicking" about the spelling and grammar used in posts (especially as I no longer spell check my posts as Aenigma and I speak a different language). I think that we are pretty good on that these days. I occassionally get a pleasant private mail pointing out things that are incorrect (when it makes a material difference) and it gives me an opportunity to make minor alterations in peace. I often chnage posts when I see them the next day as I'n goog at typos!

All in all I think we're quite good at accommodating other people's likes and dislikes without getting locked into mortal combat. From what I saw of the Usenet list, we sounded pretty civilised (as Max said, no Nazi postings anyway).

#9705 11/03/00 11:26 PM
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