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Welsh, itself, being derived from a Sassenach word meaning foreigner.
What *should be considered offensive about Michelangelo's David is that it isn't circumcised.
There is that other nagging question: If you know that a word or phrase is going to be offensive, however undeservedly, to a large group of people, and there is another term that can be used just as easily, is it right to continue using the offensive term?
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Dear Faldage: "Taffy was a Welchman, Taffy was a thief........"
Must I now forego asking for a piece of taffy?
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There is that other nagging question: If you know that a word or phrase is going to be offensive, however undeservedly, to a large group of people, and there is another term that can be used just as easily, is it right to continue using the offensive term?I think, to a large group of people, is the key here, or obvious oversight (as when, knowing there are many women firefighters you use the exclusionary fire men...however, when talking about a male or a small group of males who are firefighters, then fireman or "men" is still okay as an option) is the key phrase here. Obviously the "n" word is offensive, as is "Dago" for Italians, "Polack" for Poles, "Mick" for the Irish, "Limey" for the English, "Hunky" for Hungarians (although, being of Hungarian descent, I happen to think Hunky's pretty cool, actually  ), etc. [though, none of the ethnic friends I've had over the years seemed to mind when these epithets were employed jokingly with each other in private...not including the "n" word, of course] And mulyak for Slovaks and Slav immigrants in general...this, curiously enough, was first employed by the first Carpatho-Russian/Slovak immigrants once they were established and doing well to disparage and look down upon the "fresh-off-the-boaters". I think the Italians had a similar vindictive, mullein. In our family it's the worst heavy artillery you can roll out in a squabble, to call somebody that, mulyak...especially the older generations. But pruning pieces of words, and generic pronouns, and digging up new nuances of meaning to impart to long-standing terms to render them taboo, because small segments of certain groups demand it, seems silly and a bit self-defeating. A diehard feminist friend of mine, a practicing Wiccan and folk musician, who's into The Goddess and the fairy culture, etc., finally announced at a performance one night that she was no longer bothering to use the sexist changes to words as she had been for years, because, as she explained, one day she found herself wanting to take the "king" out of kingdom, and decided, then and there, that she, and others, were really going off the wall about all this, and that there were far better ways to work for the empowerment of women than by changing all these little pieces and nuances of words. And that feeling threatened by these words was not affirming her womanhood. Amen.
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well, I try to use other words because I'm trying to be nice. and I'll continue to teach my children thusly.
I'm done.
edit: this is in no way an implication that any of you are not nice. sorry for any misunderstanding.
formerly known as etaoin...
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well, I try to use other words because I'm trying to be nice. and I'll continue to teach my children thusly.
But that's one of the points here, eta...you're already nice, so you don't have to try to be nice. You're allowing others to paint you as unnice until you prove, or to make you prove, your nicety...that's not fair to you, or anybody. It's almost like the Catholic concept of Original Sin...which I'm well-familiar with.
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>trying to be nice.
As I understand this thread, that's not even the point. The issue is, do we have the right to impose our current standards of "nice" on, to borrow a phrase that seems particularly apt, "prior art"? To me, that is quite different from using PC-isms in personal speech from personal choice. I say "Native Americans", partly because it seems more accurate, and partly to avoid confusion with my own Indian (subcontinental) heritage. That doesn't mean I would want to edit a work of art or literature that referred to Indians, nor would I ever say that, as a kid, I played cowboys and Native Americans. What one does with regard to one's own usage of language is one thing, but this thread really seems to be more about the propriety or otherwise of bowdlerising creative works to fit current estimations of acceptably inoffensive speech.
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[though, none of the ethnic friends I've had over the years seemed to mind when these epithets were employed jokingly with each other in private...not including the "n" word, of course]
This seems to be belittling (to say the least) the art of Tupac Amaru Shakur (for example).
... and, pardon my ignorance, but what exactly is " The Goddess and the fairy culture, etc."?
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... and, pardon my ignorance, but what exactly is " The Goddess and the fairy culture, etc."?
Well, musick, briefly, the Wiccan faith focuses on Nature through the feminine perspective of the Earth Mother or Goddess, and the fairies are seen as nature spirits that work in harmony with, and through the influence of, the Earth Mother, the Goddess. This can be traced back, in myth, to the Druid legend of Queen Mab, and the fairies and Little People of Celtic lore, among others.
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...impose our current standards of "nice" on, to borrow a phrase that seems particularly apt, "prior art"? To me, that is quite different from using PC-isms in personal speech from personal choice.
Thanks, sjm--you said directly what I meant but couldn't seem to make clear with many times more words.
This very morning in church was an example; I had never realized this, but it is in our hymnal now that we are supposed to sing, "Good Christian Friends Rejoice". I ask you! As eta also indicated, this kind of thing comes down to personal choice; I am not so gung-ho on this point as to insist to my children that it should be the original way--but right now, you can bet I am singing "men" rejoice. Not all things are good just because they're old, but I happen to be the kind of person who doesn't like something I've enjoyed all my life messed with!
And, we all have our personal "lines in the sand"--some of us will always stop earlier or go further in our willingness to change whatever. And the decision-makers, whomever they happen to be, aren't going to please all of the people all of the time. Here's one change that I happen to agree was necessary: the line in My Old Kentucky Home that now reads: "'Tis summer, the people are gay;"
(This is Kentucky's state song, for those of you who didn't know.) The 1986 Kentucky state legislature officially put in the word people to replace the word darkies. Now, Stephen Foster wrote that song in 1853, and I imagine he meant the word merely descriptively. And I had sung the song that way all my life, but had not felt particularly comfortable with that word once I began to grow up.
There are some things I could say about why I disapprove of changing hymns and approve of changing our state song, but I won't go into that now. I was just using this as an example about personal choices. For all I know, my children and grand-children are/will find male-only words as offensive as I find that original word in My Old Kentucky Home now; but at present, I prefer to sing the hymns the way they were originally written--keeping in the back of my mind what my true beliefs are.
P.S.--eta, I understood (I think!) why you're doing what you said you are; and I didn't think you were implying that others are not nice, Sweetie. You're allowed to do what you want to; as are we all. Now, my ire would be up in a big hurry were you or anyone try to tell me I HAD to change this or that! I believe that may have been WO'N's point. (Please correct me if I'm wrong.)
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My grand-daughter gave me Wordsmith's book for Christmas. I just discovered that he passed
a PC test. His Chapter 6, Reduplicatives, did not contain "nitty-gritty".
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