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Previous Thread Next Thread Print Thread Page 1 of 10 1 2 3 … 9 10 Old fashioned pronouns #3654 06/28/00 02:07 PM Joined: Jun 2000 Posts: 1 M mushtaq OP stranger OP mushtaq stranger M Joined: Jun 2000 Posts: 1 Hello, I'm curious why or how English lost its second person pronouns like thee, thou, and ye. Are there particular historical reasons or is it just a linguistic fluke? Thanks! Mushtaq Copy Link to Clipboard Share Post on Facebook Share Post on Twitter Re: Old fashioned pronouns #3655 06/28/00 09:14 PM Joined: Mar 2000 Posts: 1,981 J jmh Pooh-Bah jmh Pooh-Bah J Joined: Mar 2000 Posts: 1,981 I wonder too, especially as "usted" and "vous" are still used in Spanish and French. I was never quite sure when to "tu" and when to "usted" - its probably one of those things that makes a foreigner look quite rude in Spain. Perhaps we lost them because we just weren't polite enough to want to keep them? Perhaps it was just that we had too many words? Copy Link to Clipboard Share Post on Facebook Share Post on Twitter Re: Old fashioned pronouns #3656 06/28/00 09:18 PM Joined: Mar 2000 Posts: 1,981 J jmh Pooh-Bah jmh Pooh-Bah J Joined: Mar 2000 Posts: 1,981 Apparently Quakers still use the term "thee" as in the example: Perhaps thee has noticed the point in our Friends Journal on February 15 - Friend 1964. Does anyone know if the term is still used? Copy Link to Clipboard Share Post on Facebook Share Post on Twitter Re: Old fashioned pronouns #3657 06/29/00 09:43 AM Joined: Jun 2000 Posts: 444 Sydney Australia B Bridget addict Bridget addict B Joined: Jun 2000 Posts: 444 Sydney Australia >>Perhaps thee has noticed the point in our Friends Journal on February 15 - Friend 1964<< I thought that was 'thou' as in I, me, my, mine thou, thee, thy, thine he, him, his, his etcetera. Or have I just been misled by 'me' and 'thee' sounding similar? As for the Quakers, I also think they still use 'thou' and 'thee', but don't know any to ask! Copy Link to Clipboard Share Post on Facebook Share Post on Twitter Re: Old fashioned pronouns #3658 06/29/00 11:25 AM Joined: Mar 2000 Posts: 460 Hobart, Tasmania, Australia P paulb addict paulb addict P Joined: Mar 2000 Posts: 460 Hobart, Tasmania, Australia Hail to thee, Jo and Bridget, from a 'quakerly' paulb whose wife is a Quaker. Certainly in Australia, the form 'thee' is not used in normal conversation but crops up occasionally in a more lighthearted sense. Incidentally one of the nice things about Quakers is that they do not use titles (Mr, Mrs etc); instead they use the whole name eg Dear John Smith. This applies to children as well, who will freely address adults by their full name. It sure beats the status thing! Copy Link to Clipboard Share Post on Facebook Share Post on Twitter Re: Old fashioned pronouns #3659 06/29/00 02:43 PM Joined: Mar 2000 Posts: 1,981 J jmh Pooh-Bah jmh Pooh-Bah J Joined: Mar 2000 Posts: 1,981 You would say "Fare thee well" so the quotation fits in with that usage. I tend to ignore Mr & Mrs (I'm a Ms.!!!) and prefer to use whole names - perhaps I should be a Quaker. Copy Link to Clipboard Share Post on Facebook Share Post on Twitter Re: Old fashioned pronouns #3660 06/29/00 04:00 PM Joined: Apr 2000 Posts: 10,542 this too shall pass tsuwm Carpal Tunnel tsuwm Carpal Tunnel Joined: Apr 2000 Posts: 10,542 this too shall pass > I thought that was 'thou' as in I, me, my, mine arrrgggh! I listened to the "Let It Be" CD the other day and ever since I've had one of the songs stuck in my head (is there a word for that?), and now this. All through the day I me mine, I me mine, I me mine. All through the night I me mine, I me mine, I me mine. I-me-me mine, I-me-me mine, I-me-me mine, I-me-me mine. All I can hear I me mine, I me mine, I me mine. Everyone's saying it, All through the day I me mine. All through your life I me mine. [apologies to all who end up with this stuck in their heads] Copy Link to Clipboard Share Post on Facebook Share Post on Twitter Re: Old fashioned pronouns #3661 06/29/00 06:37 PM Joined: Jun 2000 Posts: 18 Vienna, Austria A ammelah stranger ammelah stranger A Joined: Jun 2000 Posts: 18 Vienna, Austria Isn't that what's known as a (not an) "haunting tune"? But that doesn't quite convey how annoying it can be... However, the German word for a song you can't get out of your head sure does: "Ohrwurm". Yuk. Copy Link to Clipboard Share Post on Facebook Share Post on Twitter Re: Old fashioned pronouns #3662 06/29/00 06:52 PM Joined: Mar 2000 Posts: 6,511 lower upstate New York AnnaStrophic Carpal Tunnel AnnaStrophic Carpal Tunnel Joined: Mar 2000 Posts: 6,511 lower upstate New York I cannae say why we have lost the second person pronouns, when both the Latin languages and the Germanic have kept them. I'm curious and will nose around. Meanwhile, "thou" is the nominative, equivalent to "I". "Thee" is the objective, equivalent to "me". "Fare thee well" would be parsed: {May it} fare {to} thee well. And as for the Ohrwurm, I'd rather have a bookworm. Copy Link to Clipboard Share Post on Facebook Share Post on Twitter Re: Old fashioned pronouns #3663 06/29/00 07:02 PM Joined: May 2000 Posts: 112 Auckland, New Zealand D David108 member David108 member D Joined: May 2000 Posts: 112 Auckland, New Zealand >>I was never quite sure when to "tu" and when to "usted"<< When I was learning French at school, I was taught that "tu" was the familiar form of address - to a friend, peer, or sometimes to one who was perceived as "inferior" (a servant, a student, etc.) "Vous" would be the opposite - to one's superior. I suppose the same rule would apply to Spanish. Copy Link to Clipboard Share Post on Facebook Share Post on Twitter Page 1 of 10 1 2 3 … 9 10 Moderated by  Jackie  Hop To General Topics ------  Information and announcements  Q&A about words  Wordplay and fun  Words and languages in schools  Miscellany  Weekly Themes  Looking for (writers, speakers,... (Old) Weekly themes. 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