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stranger
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OP
stranger
Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 11 |
Thank you all for your kind responses.It is happy to raise something here for discussion.
I will STICK AROUND....^_^
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Carpal Tunnel
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Carpal Tunnel
Joined: Apr 2000
Posts: 3,065 |
Yes, Aji, the difference between the standard US and UK pronunciations of these words is confusing. In the unstressed or weak form, it's pretty much the same in the positive: kn. In Southern British English, the stressed or strong form of can (Yes I can.) has the same vowel as cat, but stressed or unstressed the vowel in the negative can't is more like the vowel in barn (remembering that in this variety of English r is not pronounced before a consonant). The t in can't is very lightly pronounced and in fact often disappears in connected speech. We mainly go by the difference in vowel sound. English speakers do get confused themselves sometimes and have to ask someone whether they said can or can't.
Bingley
Bingley
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Carpal Tunnel
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Carpal Tunnel
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Aji will STICK AROUND....^_^
You won't regret it.
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Joined: Nov 2000
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veteran
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veteran
Joined: Nov 2000
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Aji, welcome to the board. I don't really have anything to add to what my esteemed colleagues have provided you with; they have done a very good job. The one example I thought of was a well-known song from an old Broadway musical [Annie Get Your Gun ?] which starts, "I can do anything better than you" and which goes on between two people, "No, you can't!" "Yes, I can!". Although this is an American musical and although can't would be spoken with the short, flat vowel, that vowel sound comes out rather silly when being sung, so it's sung with the deeper English pronunciation, or something close to it.
This put a question in my mind which you will be able to answer for me: If the tones in Chinese determine the meaning of words, how do you distinguish the tones when you are singing? Is there a way to separate the musical tone from the verbal tone?
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Carpal Tunnel
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Carpal Tunnel
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I am a self confessed "ugly american" and only speak english-- but i find the tones of chinese often make it understandable..
In english, we us a rising tone/inflection to signify a question.. some versions of chinese do the same..
Once in a take out shop, the cashier, busy on the phone, seemed not to be paying attention to my order-- her father barked at her-- and i turned, and told him--Yes, she did put in a spoon and fork. His eyes widened! He asked if i spoke cantonese-- (right, when i have trouble with french!). But everything about the tones conveyed his question.. the meaning of his words were as clear as if he had spoken english.
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enthusiast
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enthusiast
Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 393 |
Probably like most non-Americans, I find the Americans near-homonyms sometimes confusing.
The theme song for the H.R. Pufnstuf TV show went "He can do a little but he can['t] do enough", which mystified me before I was a linguist. In the environment N-D of "can('t) do" it's impossible for the T to be distinctly pronounced, so it has to be left to pitch and length.
A little-known phonetic fact about English (and I don't know whether this is just English or whether it's more general) is that vowel length can be correlated with pitch. In "bead" the long vowel drops, in "bid" the short vowel has a slight rise in pitch: though these effects can be masked by grammatical or semantic uses of pitch.
Better known is the lengthening effect of voice: "bead" is longer than "beat", and "bend" is longer than "bent". The effect is slighter in "ben" vs "bent".
Some such combination of factors is operating in American "can" vs "can't" but I have to leave it to native speakers to determine exactly what.
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old hand
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old hand
Joined: Dec 2000
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Some such combination of factors is operating in American "can" vs "can't"
It seems the pitch definitely tends to rise, as you described. I've never had many problems keeping the two apart, but then again context gives away a lot. 'Aunt' and 'ant' is a whole other story though!
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Carpal Tunnel
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Carpal Tunnel
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"H.R. Pufnstuf, He can do a little but he can['t] do enough"
And to think, I always heard it as "He can't do a little, he can't do enough."
No problem hearing that second instance as can't but I heard the first one the same way. And I don't remember having heard the but.
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Carpal Tunnel
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Carpal Tunnel
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addict
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addict
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<Singin' in the Rain>
Yes, Marianna, a wonderful film, and Jean Hagen's shrill voice also reminds me of Judy Holliday in 'Adam's rib' and 'Born yesterday'.
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