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Anybody know where this comes from? In my family, it's used thusly: if the bathroom needs cleaning, someone will give it a lick and a promise - meaning a quick cleaning now, maybe (but probably not) a more thorough one later. This may come from doing "a lick of work" now, with a promise of more later, but I don't know. Any more definite notions? While we're at it - what about "a wing and a prayer?" I always have visions of a plane that's lost a wing, trying to land using the equipment described, but don't know if I heard that from a reliable source or if the little man who lives in the northeastern corner of my cranium made it up and planted it somewhere. p.s. - this is the first post I've ever put together that our beloved spell-wrecker didn't have any problems with - must be doing something wrong p.p.s. - of course, I spell-checked the above postscript and it couldn't figure out p.s. or spell-wrecker 
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My dictionary says:
4 [Colloq.] b) a short, rapid burst of activity, often careless, as in cleaning up, etc. (also lick and a promise)
IDIOMS: lick and a promise A superficial effort made without care or enthusiasm
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i've always accredited this phrase to hair origins; eg a harried mother suddenly noticing her son's hair is mussed as they climb the stairs to church, then absently licking her finger and smoothing down a cowlick, with a mental promise to brush it properly later.
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While we're at it - what about "a wing and a prayer?"
It was in a song in early days of WWII...as title and part of lyric of song entitled, aptly, "Coming In On A Wind And A Prayer"
The song was based on a real incident.
A Chaplain was aboard a US bomber as observer when the plane was attacked by German fighters as it returned from a raid over Europe. The fighter pilot's bullets disabled the two engines on one wing leaving just two engines on other wing operable.
The aircraft commander told the Chaplain to pray and nursed the plane home over the English Chanel ...
The base people thought the plane was lost in combat and we astounded to get the Captain's message that the plane and crew were "...coming in on a wing and a prayer." The plane landed safely and crew was OK.
There were many news stories about the incident and the song was very popular.
wow
P.S. re our beloved spell-wrecker
Hyla dear, it's Spellwrecker. Been using the mockonym for ages.
Mockonym : Have I coined a new word? Pooh Bahs & Ilk invited to comment. ducking for cover
wow
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"Mockronym"--I like it! And tsuwm might like it. But even if everybody else likes it, they may come and mock your nym for relegating them to the "ilk" classification. 
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relegating them to the "ilk" classification
"Ilk" means the same or same type and I cannot imagine anyone on this board being upset by being classed with you and Tsuwm! 'Tis more like aspiration!
Aloha
Wow
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"Ilk" means the same or same type and I cannot imagine anyone on this board being upset by being classed with you and Tsuwm! 'Tis more like aspiration!
Calm down, you're getting all choked up...
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Pooh Bahs & Ilk invited to comment. ducking for cover
wowWhy are you hiding? PoohBahs are a protected species, and it's not ilk hunting season. 
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and the phrase "of that ilk" is used in Scotland as part of clan names, as in "Dundas of that Ilk", "Machlachan of that Ilk" and of course the clan "Ilk of that Ilk"!
Rod
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Yeah, in our family it meant a minimal wash, i.e. wipe the dirt off the face with licked fingers.
Gross Warning: childs Joke I was reminded of:
Mummy! Mummy! May I lick the bowl please?
No dear, you flush it like everyone else does!
Rod
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A lick and a promise
From Heavens to Betsy! & Other Curious Sayings, Charles Funk:
The "lick" pertains to the rapid lapping of the tongue; it’s a small quantity of a small amount, about the amount we mean when we say that so-and-so hasn’t "a lick of sense." The "promise" is of something which might be long deferred. The expression dates back at least to 1850.
From A Hog on Ice & Other Curious Expressions , Charles Funk:
The saying is common in both England and America, and is undoubtedly several centuries old, but examples of literary use are not recorded. <huh?>
Other licks:
Lick into shape
From Hog on Ice
The saying comes from the ancient belief that:
"Beres ben brought forthe al fowle and transformyd and after by lyckynge of the fader and moder they ben brought in to theyr kyndely shap." -- The Pylgremage of the Sowle, de Guilleville, as translated in 1400.
The belief probably arose from the fact that bears cubs at birth are hairless and very small, and the mother usually keeps them concealed for four or five weeks.
From Why You Say It, Webb Garrison:
Totally without foundation but circulated for at least a thousand years, beliefs about bear cubs lead us to say that when we’ve mastered a difficult situation or made something presentable, we have licked it into shape.
One’s best/solid/good licks
From Hog on Ice:
"Lick" in American speech came to mean a spurt of speed or burst of energy, and the phrases best/solid/good licks arise from that meaning.
"I saw comin’ my gray mule, puttin’ in her best licks, and a few yards behind her was a grizzly." -- Polly Peablossom’s Wedding, TA Burke (1851).
From me:
I’m guessing that the speed sense of lick is the basis for the phrase lickety-split.
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One more meaning of lick, thought it doesn't really relate to the "and a promise" expression:
in music--jazz--one refers to a passage (particularly a complicated one) as a lick.
not sure when/where it originated. Kev? Jazzo?
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Hyla, were you in my house last weekend? I used that phrase for the first time in my life while looking sadly at the bathroom on Easter Sunday. My husband was dealing with our homemade beer and there was beer-making equipment everywhere, and beneath all that, the bathroom badly needed cleaning. As I said it, I thought I might quickly wipe up the counter with a wet rag (the lick part) and I promised to get to it later this week (this hasn't happened yet). And at that very moment the meaning of "a lick and a promise" seemed quite obvious to me, anyway.
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Oh, bean you must clean your bath room-- It a messy housekeepers trick. In every other room of the house, you can talk, or offer tea or coffee, or in some way distract your guests....but they are all alone in the bathroom! They sit down, and have a minute or two to look around..
So, always have the top of the tank and anything that can be seen from the comode immaculate-- and use white towels.. they your guest come away with a sense everything is clean... and while you might have some temporary disarray from a recent project..(like beer brewing) your house is really kept clean!
When the bathroom is clean everything is clean. When its not, nothing else counts!-- (so simple to clean a 6 room house. Clean the bathroom, and run a dust mop over the rest of the place!)
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Observations on your approach to cleaning the bathroom, Ms. Helen:
1. One does not need to keep the top of the tank clean - that's where the reading materials live.
2. I find the most effective way to deal with a dirty bathroom, or an otherwise dirty house, is to go camping. You don't worry about it when you're away, and everything seems so much cleaner (although less pristine) than the forest/desert/mountains/beach upon your return.
Hyla
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1. One does not need to keep the top of the tank clean - that's where the reading materials live.
This is slowly going way off topic but we keep our reading materials in a rack on the wall, like those ones on the doors in doctors' offices. Terribly geeky but I couldn't handle seeing magazines on every available surface, and dripping water on them.
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um, what *is* it about reading materials in a *bathroom*? i just can't understand why one would choose to extend their stay in a bathroom for longer than absolutely necessary. 
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My deepest apologies to the AWAD community for steering this thread in such a regrettable direction. That said, I'll just scat.
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ah Bridget-- Obviously not a water god! I think there are two kinds of bathroom readers--Comode (ugh!) and tub.
In the US, we tend to use one word (and one room!) for a comode, lav and bathtub. How much more civilized the Japanese are-- Bath rooms are for bathing-- they have large, insulated tubs in which you can immerse your self-- after you have first washed..
Comodes (with their two spectacular features, heated seats, and warm water for washing) and lavs are never found in the same room.-- these are people who understand simple comforts!
I've had many a book with wrinkled corners-- from turning the pages with damp fingers, read in deep tub, filled to brim with hot water. I learned early in life how to block the bottom half of the over flow to give myself an extra inch of water.
Bathrooms reading can be quite enjoyable..(and it keeps your fingers out of water-- so they don't turn into raisins!)
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so they don't turn into raisins!*great* helen, just great... did you absolutely HAVE to bring raisins into this conversation??? anyone who's had a toddler makes an instant association. blech.
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Forgive me for digging us deeper in here, but, Señorita 96, are you thinking of a Korinthenkacker?
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Dear Hyla: use a sanitized technical term: scybala.
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scybala
20 seconds of googling didn't leave me feeling like this term was as sanitized as I'd hoped.
As to korinthenkacker, which was not intended quite so scatologically as it was taken - I'll wait a bit for tsuwm to explain (if he would be so kind), as I'm sure he has the source book closer to hand than I (mine are all belowdecks, as we prepare to weigh anchor and shape a course for our new home port).
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Well, Systran's real helpful. It translates Korinthenkacker as Korinthenkacker and kacker as more kacker. I like Ænigma's translation better Korinthenkacker is kosher and kacker is Kaddish
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... der Rosinenscheißer (stickler, literally "someone who shits raisins") der Korinthenkacker
(stickler, literally "someone who craps currants") kleinkariert sein ...
http://members.nbci.com/streetgerman/Beschaeftigung.html [More Results From: members.nbci.com]
Sanitized or not, scybala has got a bit more class.
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der Rosinenscheißer (stickler, literally "someone who shits raisins")
Bridget96, do you see this!?!?!? What is a word for "coincidence" of the weirdest, most unlikely sort?
(Those wishing further explanation make ask; I'll PM with a scatological tale.)
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coincidence" of the weirdest, most unlikely sort
But this is exactly what I meant, and what I took bridget's meaning to be (we have exchanged a few PMs in the past on the wonders of parenting).
For the record, a korinthenkacker is, figuratively, a detail-obsessed person and, literally, a raisin-crapper, but as I understand it, the word is not seen (or heard, I guess) as vulgar by them what use it in their common parlance - any of our German speakers care to weigh in on this one?
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Wow quoth: nursed the plane home over the English Chanel ...Boy, they had some damn big perfume bottles in them thar dayz!
The idiot also known as Capfka ...
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The only reason one would want to leave the lid off the cistern in the loo is to catch moths. It works really well. The only reason one would want to have a lid on the cistern in the loo is to deposit reading materials. This, also, works very well. It's not called the Throne Room for nuttin' ya know! QED!
The idiot also known as Capfka ...
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Wow quoth: nursed the plane home over the English Chanel ... CapK response : Boy, they had some damn big perfume bottles in them thar dayz! Odd mistake for me to make, CapK, as I do not care for Chanel perfumes ... or the price $$$$$. Sniffing out errors again, are we? Hmmm? wow
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Odd mistake for me to make, CapK, as I do not care for Chanel perfumes ... or the price $$$$$.
Sniffing out errors again, are we? Hmmm?Oh, was it a mistake, then? Sorry, I just thought that you'd stumbled on to a really interesting fact about WWII that I'd never heard before ...
The idiot also known as Capfka ...
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just stumbled into <eeeeeewww> this thread, and all I can contribute at this late date is a quote:
If a man, at hay time or harvest, holds his fork with his left hand lowest, they say, ‘Ah! he's no good! he's kack-handed!+’
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I don't remember ever seeing a right handed man who did not hold his left hand lower on a pitchfork. To pitch hay up into a wagon, a right handed man holding the end of the fork in his right hand can pitch the hay higher and with better control.
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<<Korinthenkacker>>
"The Siege of Corinth" is a Rossini opera and it definitely shits raisins.
(sounds better than currants)
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I will not eat a raisin ever again. I never did like currants.
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Just to drag this thread back from the scatological and in the general direction of its original purpose, "lick and a promise" is a term which appears to transcend all borders between predominantly English-speaking countries. I asked an Indian (not red, the real McCoy) friend of mine who lives in Bombay about the term in an email yesterday - after reading this thread - and he replied that he'd used it that day when trying to get a reluctant six-year-old to wash before going out somewhere. Interesting, isn't it? The etymological basis of the term isn't well understood anywhere, but the meaning of the term doesn't change, regardless of culture or location. And now, back to eating dates to produce, hummph, ah, raisins? And sorry for having introduced the serious note at an inappropriate moment ...
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And now, back to eating dates to produce, hummph, ah, raisins? And sorry for having introduced the serious note at an
inappropriate moment ...
Eating dates? Are you referring to Hannibal Lechter's culinary habits?
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"eating dates to produce, hummph, ah, raising"
Dear Geoff:I am passing up a too obvious invitation to ribaldry.
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Eating dates? Are you referring to Hannibal Lechter's culinary habits?This weeks New Scientist in its Feedback column http://www.newscientist.com/feedback/ has a story concerning the commission set up by the UK health service to investigate the unfortunate practice of keeping organs of the deceased (particularly young children) without permission from the relatives. This "Retained Organs Commission" is based at the Department of Health's huge office block at the Elephant and Castle area of London which is named Hannibal House. The column also has a couple of other stories of interest to this forum including a reference to a reissue of the only film to be made in Esperanto, and that there are more Klingon speakers than Esperanto (but I guess the same number of native speakers ). And also a reference to RAS syndrome (Redundant Acronym Syndrome..). Rod PS "Elephant and Castle" is apparantly a corruption of "Infanta de Castille"
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PS "Elephant and Castle" is apparantly a corruption of "Infanta de Castille"
Interesting - I heard that the locksmiths had an elephant and a castle on their coat of arms, that they were prevalent in this area of London and that was how the name came about. Can't answer for the veracity or otherwise, however.
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Re Elephant and Castle. Capital Kiwi [why do I always think of CK as "Captain Kiwi" in a superman outfit with a bird across his chest?] says - I heard that the locksmiths had an elephant and a castle on their coat of arms, that they were prevalent in this area of London and that was how the name came about.I always believed what my father told me [including Santa Claus etc.] but Googling would support CK. http://www.quinion.com/words/qa/qa-ele1.htm states that my long held theory is probably a myth (along with Goat and Compasses = "God Encompasses") on the grounds Eleanor of Castile, the wife of Edward I wasn't an infanta (or at least wasn't known as that). The castle is really a howdah (a hunting seat) on the back of the elephant. The Elephant and Castle pub was prior to 1760 a smithy that had the same name and sign. This was used by the Cutlers' Company, a guild dating from the 13th century for workers who made knives, scissors, surgical instruments and so on. (linking across to the silver service thread!!!!) The guild used the elephant and howdah symbom. A suggestion is that the connection is the ivory used for knife handles. Thanks for the debunking of my myth CK. Next someone will be telling me that the Easter Bunny is only Mickey Mouse dressed up!  Rod
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The castle is really a howdah (a hunting seat) on the back of the elephant.
is the term howdah limited to a hunting seat? I thought a howdah was the name of the elephant "sadle". and it applied to both the kind with hood (roofs?) and open ones.
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is the term howdah limited to a hunting seat? I thought a howdah was the name of the elephant "sadle". and it applied to both the kind with hood (roofs?) and open ones.
Apologies; certainly not limited to hunting seat. My dictionary (POD) gives it as "(Usually canopied) seat for riding on elephant or camel. From Urdu hawda".
Rod
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In reply to:
Capital Kiwi [why do I always think of CK as "Captain Kiwi" in a superman outfit with a bird across his chest?
HaHa! OK, everyone who has had to make an effort to remember that it is Capital Kiwi and not Captain Kiwi, raise your hands. .... That's what I thought.
Although, Rodward, you have it slightly wrong: it is not a Superman outfit he is wearing, it is a nautical jacket with gold braid.
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everyone who has had to make an effort to remember that it is Capital Kiwi and not Captain Kiwi, raise your hands
[Raising my hand]
That's why I try to think of him as Upper Case Gooseberry whenever I can. Keeps my conception of him from getting too high an opinion of itself.
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Elephant and castle
The elephant and castle (actually, howdah, as noted in otehr replies) is, according to 2 of my handbooks, not an infrequent charge in heraldry. In fact, an elephant will generally be depicted with the "castle" by default, unless it is made clear that it does not have it.
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That's why I try to think of him as Upper Case Gooseberry whenever I can. Keeps my conception of him from getting too high an opinion of itself.That's Upper Case Chinese Gooseberry to you, my good man! And, taking Sparteye's view of my sartorial habits, an interesting contrast: Last Friday was Poppy Day here in Zild (and probably in Oz). On that day, the Returned Services Association (Vets to you poor, benighted Yanks) sell plastic poppies on the streets to raise money for the association. The poppy commemorates the poppies which grew in spring in France during WWI. As the average age of the servicemen from WWII has risen (and they themselves have declined, e.g. into wheelchairs), more and more often members of the armed forces turn out on to the streets to do the actual selling. I bought mine from a rear-admiral (well, THE rear-admiral, Somerville, we only have one of them). He's also currently the head of NZ's armed forces, such as they are. He was standing outside a coffee shop by himself, although he was doing a brisk trade (most people buy poppies). I had to laugh to myself, though. Can you imagine the Chairman of the JCS standing on the streets of Washington without a full military escort and kevlar armour, armed only with a bunch of plastic poppies and a money tin?
The idiot also known as Capfka ...
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Can you imagine the Chairman of the JCS standing on the streets of Washington without a full military escort and kevlar armour, armed only with a bunch of plastic poppies and a money tin?
Perhaps since he is still on actve duty he has yet to join the VFW.
We have the poppy sale around Memorial Day. (Late weekend in May) They are paper poppies with two leafs and a wire stem.Not many realize the connection to Flanders Field but even youngest know the poppies are to help veterans of all wars. Around here they're sold by members of the Veterans of Foreign Wars (VFW).
There is a poem Wait! I found it: (Bless Google)
"In Flanders Field"
Written in by John McCrae (1915)
After witnessing the carnage of WWI John McCrae wrote "In Flanders Field." McCrae, a Canadian, was a medical officer in the Boer War and World War I.
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In Flanders fields the poppies blow
Between the crosses, row on row
That mark our place; and in the sky
The larks, still bravely singing, fly
Scarce heard amid the guns below.
We are the Dead. Short days ago
We lived, felt dawn, saw sunset glow,
Loved and were loved, and now we lie
In Flanders fields.
Take up our quarrel with the foe:
To you from failing hands we throw
The torch; be yours to hold it high.
If ye break faith with us who die
We shall not sleep, though poppies grow
In Flanders fields.
----------------------------------------------------------
Flanders Field is in France and part of southwest Belgium. There, many battles took place in first World War.
wow
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Carpal Tunnel
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Perhaps since he is still on actve duty he has yet to join the VFW.
Well, Admiral Somerville is pretty active. Usually in defending the armed forces against Helengrad's military budget cuts. He's da man.
And as for poems which reinforce the pointlessness of war, I find this one by Siegried Sassoon pretty hard to beat and apologies for any slight memory-induced errors:
"Good morning, good morning!" the General cried
As we passed him last week our the way to the line.
Now the chaps that he smiled at are most of 'em dead,
And we're cursing his staff for incompetent swine.
"He's a cheery old card," grunted Harry to Jack
As they tramped up to Arras with rifle and pack.
But he did for 'em both with his line of attack.
Written by Sassoon in 1917 shortly before the General's line of attack did get 'im.
The idiot also known as Capfka ...
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old hand
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old hand
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 1,156 |
There's always a lot of ceremony surrounding poppies and war on November 11, which is Remembrance Day in Canada. And all kids are at least familiar with "In Flanders Fields"; most have probably had to recite it with their class or something at some time in their lives. Now the poem's been printed on our new $10 bill. (By the way, I think this is getting YART-y.)
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Carpal Tunnel
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Re: Capital Kiwi [why do I always think of CK as "Captain Kiwi" in a superman outfit with a bird across his chest?
not a Superman outfit he is wearing, it is a nautical jacket with gold braid.
I try to think of him as Upper Case Gooseberry whenever I can.
and Yet, when the Perle Mesta's of the board, myself included, invited CK and his partner, to be our guests when they land states side-- we where accused of being hoons...
Maybe the little kiwi likes being thought of as a superhero, and doesn't want us to see his dull plumage!
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Carpal Tunnel
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Maybe the little kiwi likes being thought of as a superhero, and doesn't want us to see his dull plumage!Capital Kiwi is most definitely a hero to me, no matter his plumage. And I'm glad he doesn't wear his underwear on the outside. 
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Carpal Tunnel
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And I'm glad he doesn't wear his underwear on the
outside.Whoa! Discovered at last! Of course I wear my boxers on the outside. Might as well show them off, given what they cost. Anyway, Rod, our pommy mate from IBM, has contributed a picture of me in full flight which I've uploaded to Max's i-Drive. Take a look. Personally, I think it's a great likeness! http://www.idrive.com/. For those of you with short memories or who can't work the search function, the user name is "maxquordlepleen" and the case-sensitive password is "Crescent". And once again, thanks Max.
The idiot also known as Capfka ...
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Carpal Tunnel
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Carpal Tunnel
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Of course I wear my boxers on the outside
And right cute they are, too...
But--I couldn't download the picture. I get either a screen telling me there's a problem, or after an eternity,
a window containing a small frame with the dreaded red x in it.
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