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#2233 05/12/00 06:09 AM
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pieman Offline OP
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Hello All,
I came across this phrase in The Professor and the Madman:
"The british papers, always eager to vent editorial spleen on their transatlantic rivals made hay with this particular aspect of the story."

What does it mean "to make hay" and where'd the phrase come from?

~ pieman


#2234 05/12/00 07:26 AM
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jmh Offline
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Ah that's easy -

the expression is "make hay while the sun shines" - ie. make the most of whatever is coming your way, whether it be sunshine, money, good health ...

Origin: I'm sure someone knows better but I would think it has an agricultural literal origin.


#2235 05/12/00 11:58 AM
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Carpal Tunnel
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Yes indeed, Jo, it has an agricultural origin. Speaking
as a resident of a state full of farmland, plus personal
experience on my uncle's farm in Tennessee, I can tell you
that the farmer has to get the hay harvested and
into the barn while it is completely dry. If it gets wet.
in will simply rot and be no good for feed or even
stall floor covering.


#2236 05/12/00 01:33 PM
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In pre-industrial Britain hay was stored in the field in haystacks (of 'needle in a' fame) These were not simply piles of hay but carefully constructed stacks with a thatched roof to keep the content dry and often built on platforms to keep them off the ground. Barns were used exclusively for the storage of corn (corn is a term originally meaning any grain though modern use restricts it to maize, which is not much grown in britain). The american barn appears to be a general store for lots of farm produce, equipment and livestock whereas the british barn was a careful designed building where harvested corn was stored on one side of the building, between two large opposing doors was a threshing floor where the grain was threshed from the corn (the breeze between the doors being used to winnow the chaff away) and the straw then being stored on the other side of the barn. Cattle were kept over winter in a cowhouse, sometimes called a byre, often attached or close to the straw side of the barn. It's worth noting that hay is a separate crop and is an animal feedstuff, whereas straw is a byproduct of grain cultivation and is used for animal bedding.
About as interesting as duct tape then.


#2237 05/12/00 06:48 PM
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jmh Offline
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And can you describe the roof?

Amazing how all these threads link up isn't it.


#2238 05/13/00 11:39 AM
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Brewer also has the phrase "to make hay of something": to disorganise and throw things into confusion and disorder. Before the days of the haybaler, it was tossed around with a pitchfork before being gathered in.


#2239 05/13/00 04:33 PM
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Jo asked

"And can you describe the roof?"

It the noise Jonathen Ross's dog makes.


#2240 05/13/00 05:01 PM
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Carpal Tunnel
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Cute, Philip!
Who is Jonathen Ross?

Jo, he said 'thatched' roof--I presume with STRAW, not HAY.
Wonder if it's a mansard, or what?? ;-)


#2241 05/13/00 05:32 PM
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>Wonder if it's a mansard...

if a female contractor installs a mansard roof do we have a feminist/semantics problem?

http://members.aol.com/tsuwm/

#2242 05/13/00 05:42 PM
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"And can you describe the roof?"

>It the noise Jonathen Ross's dog makes.

oh you wascal; that's a *weally obscure 'cultural' weference.


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#2243 05/14/00 05:00 PM
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Hay! Tsuwm, I think it should be a 'womansard' roof, then!
I also now understand your later weference.


#2244 05/15/00 12:03 PM
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Even among us "word harvesters" the majority, myself included, seems to be emotionally/unconsciously attached to the agri-culture of our ancestors. It would be interesting to determine the percentage of agricultural themes among metaphors in general.


#2245 05/15/00 06:19 PM
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pieman Offline OP
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Leafing through the OED I came across this word:

medkniche -
"...the quantity of hay to be given in reward to the hayward, being as much as he could lift with his middle finger as hgh as his knee."

pieman


#2246 05/15/00 06:22 PM
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jmh Offline
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"Leafing through the OED..." as one does ..

How many places could you begin a sentence like that!


#2247 05/15/00 08:21 PM
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Carpal Tunnel
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>It would be interesting to determine the percentage of
agricultural themes among metaphors in general.<

Herr Sieber,
I wonder if your compatriot, Jung, ever did a study on that while he was compiling examples for his "collective unconscious" theory?


#2248 05/17/00 06:40 AM
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Anna..,
Even though C.G.Jung always insisted on the empirical foundation of his concepts, his empirical base was more anecdotal than statistical (This is not intended as a value judgement); and his clientele hardly included any people of agricultural occupation.


#2249 05/17/00 03:59 PM
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wsieber,
a one-word agricultural metaphor that is relevant to this
thread is calling someone a 'hayseed'.


#2250 05/17/00 06:47 PM
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...and what about someone who might be too chicken to post to the forum?


#2251 05/18/00 06:00 AM
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Jackie,
Thank you, I did not know this word. I looked up its meaning in Merriam Webster.. and now I have a nagging doubt whether this is really a METAPHOR in the sense of "making hay". There must be another term for such words, in the direction of "pars pro toto".


#2252 05/18/00 10:30 AM
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Apparently the nice, warm, thatched roofs were the home of various animals on the farm including the cats, mice and dogs. When it rained, all the animals would jump down from the roof and hence the expression "Its raining cats and dogs"


#2253 05/18/00 12:07 PM
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Carpal Tunnel
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wsieber,
I stand contemned.


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