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#195073 - 12/16/10 08:43 AM Re: Pleonasm [Re: RonDavis]
LadyReader Offline
stranger

Registered: 08/28/06
Posts: 3
Today's quote, "Like a horny sightless woman on a blind date, she begins to knead her heavy friendship-ring-laden fingers into my face. 'Leptorrhine nose ... kumquat-headed ...'", contains a pleonasm.

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#195084 - 12/16/10 12:25 PM Re: Pleonasm [Re: LadyReader]
LukeJavan8 Offline
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 06/23/08
Posts: 6432
Loc: Land of the Flat Water


WELCOME, LADYREADER
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#195087 - 12/16/10 03:27 PM Re: Pleonasm [Re: LadyReader]
olly Offline
old hand

Registered: 12/18/06
Posts: 956
Loc: Auckland, New Zealand
Well spotted wink

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#195100 - 12/16/10 09:46 PM Re: Pleonasm [Re: olly]
Faldage Offline
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 12/01/00
Posts: 13803
Originally Posted By: olly
Well spotted wink


Dunno. Leptorhine is an adjective and lepto- is a combining form. You can't really say "Like a horny sightless woman on a blind date, she begins to knead her heavy friendship-ring-laden fingers into my face. 'Leptorrhine ... kumquat-headed ...'" or "... friendship-ring-laden fingers into my face. 'Lepto nose ... kumquat-headed ...'"

As for instances of ATM without the machine or PIN without the number, sure you'll run into those in the wild. They don't make ATM machine or PIN number wrong even if context makes it clear what you're talking about without the machine or number. Even with context there can be confusion.

Teller at the bank, helping a confused customer with his ATM card: "Do you have your PIN?"

Customer: "Yes ma'am. Rat cheer in mah pocket. It's a BIC."

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#195102 - 12/16/10 11:42 PM Re: Pleonasm [Re: Faldage]
Jackie Offline

Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 03/15/00
Posts: 11609
Loc: Louisville, Kentucky
Rat Ahem. That should be raht. Rat is pronounced ray-ut.

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#195108 - 12/17/10 06:09 AM Re: Pleonasm [Re: Jackie]
Faldage Offline
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 12/01/00
Posts: 13803
I'm spelling using SWE conventions. If I'd meant it to be pronounced ray-ut I'd've spelled it ray-ut.

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#195112 - 12/17/10 09:54 AM Re: Pleonasm [Re: Faldage]
tsuwm Offline
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 04/03/00
Posts: 10521
Loc: this too shall pass
and if I'd've meant PIN to be pronounced 'pen'.. well, I didn't, because it's just not, here.

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#195119 - 12/17/10 07:55 PM Re: Pleonasm [Re: RonDavis]
Faldage Offline
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 12/01/00
Posts: 13803
The argument that there's other ways of saying it without confusion so the way you're saying it is wrong is a non-starter. There's always other ways of saying it.

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#195128 - 12/18/10 09:22 AM Re: grammaticasters of the whirled peace untie [Re: RonDavis]
zmjezhd Offline
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 08/13/05
Posts: 3290
Loc: R'lyeh
Nobody has said yet what exactly is wrong with redundancy. It seems useful to me. Sometimes its inflectional concord between words (which is a requirement of some languages and its absence would signal a grammatical error); sometimes it's for rhetorical effect (and we're all for that where and when appropriate); sometimes it's to avoid ambiguity (which seems a good thing, too); and sometimes it's something which annoys a select group of speakers (who usually seem wrong about other aspects of language, so I'd say it's something to do with them and not the language)..
_________________________
Ceci n'est pas un seing.

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#195133 - 12/18/10 09:34 PM Re: grammaticasters of the whirled peace untie [Re: zmjezhd]
Faldage Offline
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 12/01/00
Posts: 13803
This subject came up in the context of pilotless drones back almost 4 years ago on Language Log. They do a pretty good job of discussing the nature of modification.

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