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#19094 - 02/27/01 09:17 AM Re: Attitudes
of troy Offline
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 10/17/00
Posts: 5400
Loc: rego park
Yes-- there have been some studies with infants-- and girl infants prefer womens faces, and boy infants prefer mens faces (except for their mothers face)-- and infants seem happier with faces that have colors and shapes they are familiar with-- so white babies tend to prefer white faces, black babies prefer black faces, etc. and its not just color-- with photo filters you can give an asian face (with eyefolds, say) a pale, rosy complexion-- but babies are not fooled.. such trick photos often seem to scare babies-- so it seems its not just color, its general shapes of noses, eyes, lips and earlobes, along with hair and skin color- the whole package!
Babies who parents wore eye glasses where not upset with faces wearing glasses, but prefered faces with out glasses (and any parent can tell you, at an early age, babies learn to pull off your eyeglasses. Babies who's father wore beard, where happier with hairy faces..

So we do have have (or aquire at a very early age) a preference for faces that look like our own --or our primary care givers.

There a natural tendency to want to look at people who look like ourselves-- and we also have a natural tendency towards languages-- but most spoke languages are more complex, and have more complicated rules than "pidgeons" -- something language experts recognize as languages that children "make up" when adults of may different language groups come to gether.

So with culture, languages take on more than the simplest rules that are used to form pidgeons-- and with the language, we can extend our culture to take it past the simple preference we aquire as infants.

So i think Francais Pi is right-- we all have to make an effort to learn to be accepting-- and as parents, or just members of society, we have to make an effort to teach openess and acceptance.. just as we teach advanced rules of grammer-- not just in school, but by our everyday behavior.

_________________________
my other obsession

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#19095 - 02/27/01 11:02 AM Re: welcome beelzebub
satin Offline
member

Registered: 01/26/01
Posts: 107
Jackie, I thank you and everyone for the welcome. This is a very interesting group of characters. (names and ideas). Luckily I read the other thread first so no dis adhered. I have a sibling who is also a member of this group and got me interested. That person is much smarter than I am so I am learning along with all the other newbies. Hopefully I can become (at some time) a contributing member but it will take some time before I feel adequate enough, especially surrounded by so much intellegence. Satin


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#19096 - 02/27/01 11:17 AM Re: welcome beelzebub
of troy Offline
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 10/17/00
Posts: 5400
Loc: rego park
Oh Satin-- you are a contributing member! you have made at least 3 contributions to my knowledge (I could look at your profile, and find out if you made more--- but i prefer to get to know people from their posts..)

and do please hang out here, Mark Twain said the way to get an education was to hang around people smarter than your self (and to read) that why i hang out... Every one on the board has something to teach me!

_________________________
my other obsession

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#19097 - 02/27/01 11:27 AM Re: Smart Satin
wow Offline
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 11/25/00
Posts: 3439
Loc: New England, USA
it will take some time before I feel adequate enough, especially surrounded by so much intellegence. Satin
-----------------------------------------------------
Whomever or whatever that intelligence is sign them up ... we need all the help we can get.

Really, now, each member has something unique to contribute from reading, experience, hobbies and/or jobs. And I am sure you do, too!
And I'll take this opportunity to thank, each and severally, the Board Members who have computer expertise and have shared it with a generosity beyond patience with me!
wow




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#19098 - 02/27/01 11:31 AM Re: contributions
wow Offline
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 11/25/00
Posts: 3439
Loc: New England, USA
that why i hang out... Every one on the board has something to teach me!
----------------------------------------------------------
You're no slouch yourself, of Troy!
wow


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#19099 - 02/27/01 01:30 PM Re: Attitudes
ladymoon Offline
member

Registered: 01/07/01
Posts: 137
Loc: Usually the western United Sta...
I agree that I disagree with the song "You have to be carefully taught." While there are some obvious cases of carefully taught hatred. I believe a lot of predjucices are learned from a snide comment here and a misunderstanding there. I also believe some hurtful things said are not meant, simply because what was said and what was understood aren't always the same thing. I'm sure a chat group about words knows the power of words. Sometimes the delievery is imperfect. We don't realize how ugly it sounds on the other end. Perhaps it's hard to understand how ignorant "Black people eat fried chicken" or "Chinese people own laundries" sounds until it's happened to us. And Maybe? when we talk about a good word gone bad, we're not saying something nasty but commenting on how the definition has gone from meaning happy to homosexual to uncool.


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#19100 - 02/27/01 03:32 PM Re: Attitudes in music
wow Offline
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 11/25/00
Posts: 3439
Loc: New England, USA
The composer was trying to make a point and get people thinking and talking ... (one hopes in that order )looks like he succeeded.
wow
P. S. The song comes from the musical play "South Pacific" written just after WW II. Different times, different attitudes.

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#19101 - 02/27/01 03:34 PM Re: Attitudes
Geoff Offline
old hand

Registered: 11/12/00
Posts: 819
Loc: Portland,Oregon, USA
And Maybe? when we talk about a good word gone bad, we're not saying something nasty but commenting on how the definition has gone from meaning happy to homosexual to uncool.

Since I'm the one who originally stated a disdain for the shift in the connotation of "gay," I wish to tell you, ladymoon, that you've hit the issue dead center for me! Words can be missiles of destruction or feathers with which to tickle, or particles of knowledge, or splints and gauze to bandage and heal, depending on context. But it goes beyond words, of course. I, an Anglo man, have Chinese and Afro-American friends, as well as friends born in foreigh lands, (I'm in the USA) all of whom have faced xenophobia here in this supposedly "enlightened" country, this supposed "melting pot" of the world. My last lover was French, and got called a "Frog" in pejorative ways many times, even though she's white, and speaks impeccable English. A Belizian friend has been called "nigger" on occasion. Because English is the language of Belize (formerly British Honduras) people here assume such people to be from the USA, yet, ironically, if white USA denizens hear a black person speaking with an accent, they don't seem so immediately prejudiced, as though a reverse-xenophobia, or an attraction to the exotic, were at work. A Chinese friend tells me that she's shunned at work because of her very heavy accent, so it appears that my previous statement only holds true if the accent isn't TOO exotic! Might it be that the internet will be the true "Melting pot," the true equalizer?


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#19102 - 02/27/01 03:44 PM Re: Attitudes
Max Quordlepleen Offline
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 08/12/00
Posts: 3409
But it goes beyond words, of course. I, an Anglo man, have Chinese and Afro-American friends, as well as friends born in foreigh lands, (I'm in the USA) all of whom have faced xenophobia here in this supposedly "enlightened" country, this supposed "melting pot" of the world.

Such xenophobia is universal, I fear. My sister's husband is black, of mixed German/Ghanaian descent, I think, though raised in NZ. When househunting, they often found that apartments available for rent when she went to view them had suddenly been taken by the time she went back with her husband. Just last year, an Nigerian man was badly beaten on a beach in Christchurh (the spiritual hearland of white supremacy in NZ) while hundreds of people just watched. A corner store run by Indians in my hometown was forced to close after repeated acts of intimidation and violence, the last of which was firebomb thrown into the shop while it was being staffed by a 14 year-old girl. Such overt acts of xenophobia are the fruits that grow from the seeds sown in the language of hate.


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#19103 - 02/27/01 03:47 PM Re: Attitudes
wow Offline
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 11/25/00
Posts: 3439
Loc: New England, USA
Ladymoon and Geoff :
You raise some telling points ... it's just so depressing to hear about such bigotry ... especially for one lucky enough to have lived in Hawaii where races mix and even make "matches" so well.
One can but try to accept people for what they are and hope to set a good example. For consolation I think of the Hindu saying : "You cannot argue with a man who is spending his first time on earth."
wow


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