Wordsmith.org: the magic of words

Wordsmith Talk

About Us | What's New | Search | Site Map | Contact Us  

Page 2 of 8 < 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 >
Topic Options
#182001 - 01/23/09 08:35 PM Re: Sui generis [Re: Fauve]
twosleepy Offline
old hand

Registered: 02/28/08
Posts: 876
Loc: western NY
Originally Posted By: Fauve
3) On your final comment sleepy, I was wondering, do you prefer "data are" or "data is"?

I'm slowly getting used to data are, having been committed to "data is", for years. Apparently the Times still uses both. The example you were wondering about seems more natural for me to use the plural because the reference to the "collection of ex-presidents". With data, I guess I've always been used to viewing it as singular.

I have to admit, although it makes my prescriptivist fairy cringe, that my ear prefers "data is". Thing is, you almost never hear "datum", but I suppose that would be "datum is". Sometimes ya just gotta throw up your hands and go with your gut! :0)

Oh, but "collection" is singular, and is the subject, whereas "of ex-presidents" is only the modifier. If you drop the modifier, are you still comfortable? "...the only people that know are the collection we have."

Top
#182002 - 01/23/09 09:38 PM Re: Sui generis [Re: LukeJavan8]
Faldage Offline
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 12/01/00
Posts: 13803
Originally Posted By: LukeJavan8

There are basically two main pronunciations of Latin: Classic and Ecclesiastical.
Classic would call Caesar: "Ky zer"
Ecclesiastical would say; "Say zar"

If you are classic: it is: su ee gay nay ris
if you're Ecclesiastical: su ee jen er is


You can subdivide the Ecclesiastical into, mainly, German (Caesar = tseh sar) and Italianate (Caesar = tsheh sar). There may be other versions of the Ecclesiastical. Then there's US legal Latin which is basically an abomination. Sine die, which would be "see neh dee eh" in Classical, or either of the main Ecclesiasticals, is "sigh knee die" in US legal.

Top
#182009 - 01/24/09 06:23 PM Re: Sui generis [Re: twosleepy]
Fauve Offline
newbie

Registered: 09/13/08
Posts: 35
Loc: New Yorker

[/quote]
Oh, but "collection" is singular, and is the subject, whereas "of ex-presidents" is only the modifier. If you drop the modifier, are you still comfortable? "...the only people that know are the collection we have." [/quote]

I guess I fell into the trap there. Now I feel very uncomfortable! frown

Top
#182010 - 01/24/09 06:32 PM Re: Sui generis [Re: Fauve]
Faldage Offline
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 12/01/00
Posts: 13803
On the other hand, it's not the collection that knows, it's the ex-presidents that make up the collection. And they know.

Top
#182011 - 01/24/09 08:57 PM Re: Sui generis [Re: LukeJavan8]
PastorVon Offline
member

Registered: 12/30/08
Posts: 107
Loc: USA, North Carolina

There are basically two main pronunciations of Latin: Classic and Ecclesiastical.
Classic would call Caesar: "Ky zer"
Ecclesiastical would say; "Say zar"

If you are classic: it is: su ee gay nay ris
if you're Ecclesiastical: su ee jen er is [/quote]

Well, since Obama claims to be the President of the common man, what is he doing using Latin regardless of the way it is pronounced? To me it is too "generous sooey" amy way you slice it.

I thought A.W.A.D. dealt with words that were common to English. There are some Latin phrases and clauses that may have become appropriate to spoken and written English; but it would seem that this is not one of them.

I don't think I'm long for AWAD's Forums. Since beginning to post here, I've been getting a lot of canned ham and was getting none before.

Top
#182019 - 01/25/09 10:17 AM Re: Sui generis [Re: PastorVon]
zmjezhd Offline
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 08/13/05
Posts: 3290
Loc: R'lyeh
Classic would call Caesar: "Ky zer"
Ecclesiastical would say; "Say zar"


The reconstructed classical pronunciation of Latin would pronounce Caesar /'kajsar/ (in Greek it was transcribed &#922;&#945;&#943;&#963;&#945;&#961; kaisar) and the Italian (or Ecclesiastical) would be /'&#679;&#603;zar/. Many of the European countries have (had) their own peculiar Latin pronunciation bringing it more into line with the phonological inventory of the corresponding national languages.

Since beginning to post here, I've been getting a lot of canned ham and was getting none before.

If you're concerned about spam emails, one way to lighten the flow is to get yourself a Yahoo, Gmail, or Hotmail account and only use that when signing up for online forums. Gmail has a particularly nice spam filter.
_________________________
Ceci n'est pas un seing.

Top
#182022 - 01/25/09 10:58 AM Re: Sui generis [Re: Faldage]
Fauve Offline
newbie

Registered: 09/13/08
Posts: 35
Loc: New Yorker
Originally Posted By: Faldage
On the other hand, it's not the collection that knows, it's the ex-presidents that make up the collection. And they know.


Thank you Faldage. I'm feeling more comfortable again..

Top
#182050 - 01/26/09 12:25 PM Re: Sui generis [Re: Fauve]
LukeJavan8 Offline
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 06/23/08
Posts: 6789
Loc: Land of the Flat Water
Originally Posted By: Fauve
Then there's always the German pronunciation of Latin. Yet another variant.


Exactly. I think I was just thinking about taking Latin in the US and changing schools
in high school. I had to learn to re-pronounce everything
Veni, vidi, vici.
l) Vay nee, vee dee, vee chee
2) wen nee, wid ee, wik kee.
_________________________
----please, draw me a sheep----

Top
#182051 - 01/26/09 12:26 PM Re: Sui generis [Re: LukeJavan8]
LukeJavan8 Offline
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 06/23/08
Posts: 6789
Loc: Land of the Flat Water

For those who did not read AWAD< Anu, this week:
Joke a few years past. Chinese restaurant served
Chop suey generous.
_________________________
----please, draw me a sheep----

Top
#182077 - 01/27/09 09:32 AM Re: Sui generis [Re: Fauve]
The Pook Offline
old hand

Registered: 02/20/08
Posts: 1067
Loc: Tasmania
Originally Posted By: Fauve
3) On your final comment sleepy, I was wondering, do you prefer "data are" or "data is"?

Data is ...an android.

Top
Page 2 of 8 < 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 >

Moderator:  Jackie 
Forum Stats
8769 Members
16 Forums
13814 Topics
216162 Posts

Max Online: 3341 @ 12/09/11 02:15 PM
Newest Members
Rupak, DeathCake, malagachica, Jamie, pr3sedentedonut
8769 Registered Users
Who's Online
0 registered (), 39 Guests and 5 Spiders online.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Top Posters (30 Days)
LukeJavan8 104
endymion6 101
wofahulicodoc 95
AlimaeHP 14
Tromboniator 11
tsuwm 2
BranShea 2
wsieber 1
DeathCake 1
Kokopelli 1
Top Posters
wwh 13858
Faldage 13803
Jackie 11610
tsuwm 10525
Buffalo Shrdlu 7210
LukeJavan8 6789
AnnaStrophic 6511
Wordwind 6296
of troy 5400
BranShea 5284

Disclaimer: Wordsmith.org is not responsible for views expressed on this site. Use of this forum is at your own risk and liability - you agree to hold Wordsmith.org and its associates harmless as a condition of using it.

Home | Today's Word | Yesterday's Word | Subscribe | FAQ | Archives | Search | Feedback
Wordsmith Talk | Wordsmith Chat

© 2014 Wordsmith