|
|
Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 13,803
Carpal Tunnel
|
Carpal Tunnel
Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 13,803 |
Not to mention, an English or, at least, international interpretation.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 557
addict
|
|
addict
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 557 |
Quote:
I've also seen the term used in recipes, to mean "set-up" (e.g. specific pans or utensils you will need, how hot to preheat the oven, etc).
That's mise en place.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Mar 2000
Posts: 6,511
Carpal Tunnel
|
|
Carpal Tunnel
Joined: Mar 2000
Posts: 6,511 |
Quote:
Quote:
I've also seen the term used in recipes, to mean "set-up" (e.g. specific pans or utensils you will need, how hot to preheat the oven, etc).
That's mise en place.
Oops. Thanks, Myridon!
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2000
Posts: 4,757
Carpal Tunnel
|
|
Carpal Tunnel
Joined: Sep 2000
Posts: 4,757 |
I was very surprised to see the generalised “everything that happens between the script and the screen” kind of definition. I have always heard it used to explicitly mean the ‘scene setting’ – in other words a particular framing or keynote shot that defines the emotional tenor of the film. Sure, that obviously reflects the directorial eye – but the latter meaning comes, I believe, by extension from the simple meaning: scene setting.
The Straight Dope article, btw, is simply bollocks. They have the meaning of metteur-en-scéne completely wrong by 180 degrees – even wiki gets that right.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2000
Posts: 2,891
Carpal Tunnel
|
|
Carpal Tunnel
Joined: Sep 2000
Posts: 2,891 |
>>>kwebeckese >>>HA! An odd spelling, but very phonetically apt.  =========== >>>Not to mention, an English or, at least, international interpretation. Aye, but it's like when you hear a tune it's hard to get it out of your head. It is a very common expression here so if I give the French definition that is what will niggle its way into people's thoughts. My abstaining is exactly like Alex's "whited-out" section. He wanted peoples' opinions without influencing them.
Last edited by belMarduk; 03/27/06 05:53 PM.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 1,819
Pooh-Bah
|
|
OP
Pooh-Bah
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 1,819 |
BTW I meant to initiate this discussion in the Q&A forum rather than "wordplay & fun" but no matter. So is there a term for setting up a shot in a way that puts the viewer into the scene emotionally or in terms of point of view? Some examples of this that come to mind are: (1) The early scenes in "Saving Private Ryan" when the camera is in the landing craft with the soldiers as they approach the beach, giving the perspective of the soldiers (the floor of the boat, or the back of someone's head). (2) The long opening shot in "The Dancer Upstairs" in which we're riding through the South American countryside at dusk in a vehicle. The people in the car are not speaking and the only sound is the radio and the road noise. (3) In "Rosemary's Baby" a phone rings in another room, and the camera stays put while the character goes to answer the phone just beyond our view. We're left in the position of the visitor waiting in the living room. (Director Polanksi remarked that he delighted in watching audience members lean to one side to try to see around the corner.) (4) In "In the Bedroom" after Tom Wilkins has resolved the conflict (leaving this deliberately vague in case you haven't seen the movie), the camera lingers on sunlight coming through a window while the curtains sway in the breeze. One term that comes to mind is cinema verite but that's not quite it. In example (1) Spielberg dabbles in cinema verite such as letting water slosh up on the lens as if the footage we're seeing is shot by a combat cameraman who is himself in harm's way. But really the techniques are separate but not mutually exclusive. In example (4) I'd say that the shot does more than symbolize serenity -- it is exactly the sort of sensuous domestic detail that you might take notice of and pleasure in yourself if all were right in the house, so it manipulates you to feel the way the character feels at that moment. The common thread is that each example puts the viewer into the action in some way. The scenes have other attributes as well. Three of those four create tension by making the viewer wait, for example.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Mar 2001
Posts: 2,379
Pooh-Bah
|
|
Pooh-Bah
Joined: Mar 2001
Posts: 2,379 |
1) might be called 'subjective POV' or 'subjective camera,' I suppose. I don't think Cinema Verite is the right term. It is not an attempt to cut away layers of production, but, rather, highly designed production effect that I think he uses not only to lend a feeling of immediacy, but of authenticity: since it is typical of that kind of filming, and, perhaps, of the archival material that comprises the visual frame of reference most of us have of the war. With respect to the latter, Spielberg used a similar technique in Schindler in staging a number of scenes to closely resemble archival stills.
2) [don't know the film]
3) Although this does bring the viewer into the set, it also removes -- or alienates -- him from the action. Since it both makes us aware of the camera and causes us to identify with it it would be a sort of hybrid of objective and subjective perspective.
4) Don't know the film but "in danger of being cheesy" comes to mind as a term.
Hitchcock famously played with breaching the plane of the screen and, rather than drawing the viewer in, rupturing the plane and attacking him. His pretty much says this of the cold, staring eye of the shower scene victim in Psycho. What he does *not* say is why he holds the shot so long that she finally can't help but twitch her eye. I suspect it's all part of the same ploy, though.
Sorry, that's not much help with the specific terminology. I just wanted to point out the the techniques you mention are related, but quite different from each other.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 1,773
Pooh-Bah
|
|
Pooh-Bah
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 1,773 |
While watching a movie with director's commentary last night, I took note that the director referred to a certain shot as mes-en-scene; he used it to label a lingering master shot.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 1,819
Pooh-Bah
|
|
OP
Pooh-Bah
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 1,819 |
Quote:
4) Don't know the film but "in danger of being cheesy" comes to mind as a term.
He he well don't judge it too harshly by my description alone. It's not nearly as cheesy as it sounds. (Unlike, say, the deliberately cheesy shot of the [clearly fake] robin in the window in "Blue velvet".) It's actually a very good movie characterized by its restraint.
I agree that the four examples I provided use different technical devices, but it seemed that they achieved similar emotional results. I think we disagree on what cinema verite means. I was using the term (perhaps incorrectly) to apply to fake-documentary styles. An extreme example of this would be the faux documentary The Battle of Algiers. "Saving Pvt Ryan" as a whole does not fall into that category but the Omaha Beach section seems to dabble in it IMO by mimicking the look of old newsreel footage, with the color desaturated a bit to approach the feel of black and white.
If you like mysteries and thrillers you might like "The Dancer Upstairs." It's not a car-chases-and-gunfights sort of movie. It's more atmospheric. I'd compare it to "Gorky Park" in terms of pace and tone. Incidentally, it was directed by John Malkovich.
Last edited by Alex Williams; 03/28/06 06:14 PM.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2000
Posts: 4,757
Carpal Tunnel
|
|
Carpal Tunnel
Joined: Sep 2000
Posts: 4,757 |
> a lingering master shot
Yes, that's what I have always heard it used to describe - what I referred to as a keynote shot.
|
|
|
|
Forums16
Topics13,913
Posts229,318
Members9,182
| |
Most Online3,341
Dec 9th, 2011
|
|
|
0 members (),
492
guests, and
0
robots. |
|
Key:
Admin,
Global Mod,
Mod
|
|
|
|
