|
|
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 3
stranger
|
OP
stranger
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 3 |
Hello AWADtalk. I've been receiving AWAD by e-mail for about a year, but never checked out the webpage properly. I wasn't even aware there was a chat forum. It was only once I went hunting through Anu's archives after a word when I spotted the link. I hope you can help me with my problem. I was reading an interesting article about visual perception in the New York Times when I came across the interesting word: "pareidolia", which you've no doubt already heard of and perhaps discussed. I hadn't heard of it, but a google search threw up a slew of articles about faces on tortillas and faces on Mars and even a face (if you can call it a face) in the smoke of the burning World Trade Center. Anyway, in one of these articles I found yet another word: "apophenia". I tried to get to the bottom of exactly what the difference between the two is, and am finally desperate (or curious?) enough to put it to a forum. Here are the dictionary definitions of the two words: Quote:
pareidolia
a type of illusion or misperception involving a vague stimulus which is perceived as clearly being something
Quote:
apophenia
the spontaneous perception of connections and meaningfulness in unrelated things; seeing patterns where none, in fact, exist
It looks like a case of tomayto-tomahto to me, but I'm hoping someone will be able to refine the distinction.
Thanks in advance for any light you can shed on this,
Nathan.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 7,210
Carpal Tunnel
|
|
Carpal Tunnel
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 7,210 |
welcome, Nathan! I'm wondering if pareidolia isn't more about visual stimulus, and usually faces, and apophenia more about any sort of experiential connection? the wikipedia discussions around the two words gives a better comparison: PareidoliaApopheniaI bet there's a previous discussion here about these two words as well, though I haven't done a search. 
formerly known as etaoin...
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2000
Posts: 4,757
Carpal Tunnel
|
|
Carpal Tunnel
Joined: Sep 2000
Posts: 4,757 |
Hi Nathan and welcome. My understanding is that the former is just to do with perception of visual stimulus – think Rorschach test – whilst the latter is a much more recent coinage to describe false pattern-making in any data stream.
If this is wrong no doubt our resident sock puppet will be along in force to correct the error.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 7,210
Carpal Tunnel
|
|
Carpal Tunnel
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 7,210 |
actually, turns out this IS our sock puppet. 
formerly known as etaoin...
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2000
Posts: 4,757
Carpal Tunnel
|
|
Carpal Tunnel
Joined: Sep 2000
Posts: 4,757 |
yeah, I guessed. 
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 3
stranger
|
|
OP
stranger
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 3 |
Dramatis Personae:
ullrich, Homo Loquens, iamkim, Stag Beetle, Person Man.
* * *
But is this not a legitimate query? Is Nathan not my most pleasant incarnation? And how can this be a sock puppet if Nathan is my real name?
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 5,400
Carpal Tunnel
|
|
Carpal Tunnel
Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 5,400 |
thanks nathan, i knew of the phenomia, but didn't know there were words to describe them.
the man in the moon, or the canals of mars are illusions of time and lighting.. and imagination. a form of pareidolia
but hearing music in rain drop is (well not seeing, but hearing) patterns were none in fact exist. (apophenia)
i suspect, if you get to the roots of the words, the difference is perhaps clearer..
just looking at pareidolia. is see eido in the center.. and know this root for kaleidoscopes
(a made up word form greet roots--kali a greek root word for beautiy (as in caligraphy) eido (way (process, means) and scope (seeing, being able to see) --kaleidoscopes are a beautiful way to see things. (and they are, aren't they!)
eido in pareidolia is based on the way we perceive things. NH' (now gone) old man of the mountain, only looked like an old man from a certain vantage point. a few miles back on the road, he wasn't there, a few miles further down the road, he disappeared again.
from a single point he existed.. the illusion was real
(the face in the smoke of the world trade center could be seen if you went through the footage frame by frame.. but not if you watched at normal speed--it was there..as an illusion.)
but apophenia--there is nothing there but imagination..
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 7,210
Carpal Tunnel
|
|
Carpal Tunnel
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 7,210 |
you are more clever than me... I'm anti-apophenistically challenged. or something.
formerly known as etaoin...
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Apr 2000
Posts: 10,542
Carpal Tunnel
|
|
Carpal Tunnel
Joined: Apr 2000
Posts: 10,542 |
The question remains, as asked in the parallel thread, why are you asking these questions in this way. If you've already formed an opinion, present it up front. It really presents you in a negative light to go about these things as you have been.
In fact, it seems quite purposeful on your part -- although what that purpose might be is way beyond my ken, Nathan.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 3,467
Carpal Tunnel
|
|
Carpal Tunnel
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 3,467 |
Quote:
Dramatis Personae:
ullrich, Homo Loquens, iamkim, Stag Beetle, Person Man.
* * *
But is this not a legitimate query? Is Nathan not my most pleasant incarnation? And how can this be a sock puppet if Nathan is my real name?
Ban all of them. A banning is a death sentence, not a supsension. We're tired of wondering and worrying if every new person is a troll.
You, sir, are an abomination upon our land. You are anathema. You are cursed.
Stand not upon the order of your going but go at once. And take your white horse with you.
TEd
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 3
stranger
|
|
OP
stranger
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 3 |
Quote:
Ban all of them. A banning is a death sentence, not a supsension. We're tired of wondering and worrying if every new person is a troll.
You, sir, are an abomination upon our land. You are anathema. You are cursed.
Stand not upon the order of your going but go at once. And take your white horse with you.
You silly little man.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 7,210
Carpal Tunnel
|
|
Carpal Tunnel
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 7,210 |
I am all for giving people second chances, but the fact remains, you have paid no price for your being banned.
if it were my choice, which it is not, I would advocate for a year, or at minimum, six months. then, if you were ready to come back, as a "pleasant" person, I would welcome you back.
but then, how would we know?
formerly known as etaoin...
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Mar 2001
Posts: 2,379
Pooh-Bah
|
|
Pooh-Bah
Joined: Mar 2001
Posts: 2,379 |
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2000
Posts: 2,788
Carpal Tunnel
|
|
Carpal Tunnel
Joined: Sep 2000
Posts: 2,788 |
I've been receiving AWAD by e-mail for about a year, but never checked out the webpage properly. I wasn't even aware there was a chat forum. It was only once I went hunting through Anu's archives after a word when I spotted the link. I hope you can help me with my problem.
Lying, even lying pleasantly, is not a basis on which to regain trust once forfeited.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2005
Posts: 38
newbie
|
|
newbie
Joined: Sep 2005
Posts: 38 |
Quote:
I am all for giving people second chances, but the fact remains, you have paid no price for your being banned.
if it were my choice, which it is not, I would advocate for a year, or at minimum, six months. then, if you were ready to come back, as a "pleasant" person, I would welcome you back.
but then, how would we know?
Well, it's too late. All my accounts have been locked. And I guess, after this post, they'll block this one too and then you'll finally be rid of me.
It partakes somewhat of the Procrustean.
|
|
|
|
Forums16
Topics13,913
Posts229,317
Members9,182
| |
Most Online3,341
Dec 9th, 2011
|
|
|
0 members (),
596
guests, and
1
robot. |
|
Key:
Admin,
Global Mod,
Mod
|
|
|
|
