|
|
Joined: Sep 2005
Posts: 203
enthusiast
|
OP
enthusiast
Joined: Sep 2005
Posts: 203 |
Just finished watching the movie The Sixth Sense.
You will remember the scene in the church where Cole, the little boy who "sees dead people" is playing with his soldiers and makes one of them speak in Latin :
MALCOLM : What was that you were saying before with your soldiers? Day pro fun...?
COLE : De profundis clamo ad te domine.
Malcolm stares surprised.
COLE : It's called Latin. It's a language.
Malcolm nods at the information.
Yes, Malcolm (Bruce Willis) nods, then he runs home to his Latin dictionary and writes it out in English as : "Out of the depths, I cry to you Lord" and everyone's skin creeps.
However, I find the phrase is written elsewhere as:
"De profundis clamavi ad te Domine."
My Latin's a little rusty : /
Anyone?
Last edited by Homo Loquens; 10/21/05 01:41 PM.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 3,290
Carpal Tunnel
|
|
Carpal Tunnel
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 3,290 |
"I have cried out to you, O Lord, from the depths."
Clamavi is the present perfect indicative form of clamo 'to call out, shout'. It's part of the liturgy of the Mass. (Originally from the Vulgate Bible, Psalms cxxix.1.)
[Added last parenthetical.)
Last edited by zmjezhd; 10/21/05 01:54 PM.
Ceci n'est pas un seing.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 7,210
Carpal Tunnel
|
|
Carpal Tunnel
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 7,210 |
Quote:
Just finished watching the movie The Sixth Sense.
You will remember the scene
no, I won't. never seen the film.
formerly known as etaoin...
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2000
Posts: 2,788
Carpal Tunnel
|
|
Carpal Tunnel
Joined: Sep 2000
Posts: 2,788 |
Yup, the Vulgate version of Psalm 129:1 reads "De profundis clamavi ad te Domine."
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Mar 2000
Posts: 11,613
Carpal Tunnel
|
|
Carpal Tunnel
Joined: Mar 2000
Posts: 11,613 |
Ooh, eta, you should--it's really good!
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 3,467
Carpal Tunnel
|
|
Carpal Tunnel
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 3,467 |
Quote:
"I have cried out to you, O Lord, from the depths."
Clamavi is the present perfect indicative form of clamo 'to call out, shout'. It's part of the liturgy of the Mass. (Originally from the Vulgate Bible, Psalms cxxix.1.)
[Added last parenthetical.)
Actually the word for "to call out, shout" isn't clamo, it's clamere.
When I took Latin we learned that a complete construction of a verb could be made from the big 4: first person present, infinitive, first person past tense, first person future tense.
So when you "describe" the verb clamo, you list itas clamo, clamere, clamavi, clamatus. Looking at clamatus (translated I called out) you can see where we got the words with "clamation in them, such as declamation, exclamation, proclamation, etc.
Clamo is a regular verb, IIRC, and it wasn't really necessary to list it with all four verb forms, but for irregular verbs it was vital:
To be in Latin is sum, esse, fui, futurus, while to go as to move from one place to another is eo, ire, ivi, itus.
As I recall, if a verb is irregular in Latin it is most likely irregular in English.
Of course, with irregular verbs such as sum, there wasn't much rhyme or reason:
Sum -- I am
es -- you (singular) are
est -- he, she, it is
summus -- we are
estes -- you (plural) are
sunt -- they are.
And I absolutely cannot remember eo, but I am certan it was not regular.
A regular Latin verb's present follows the form:
clamo
clamas
clamat
for the singular and I confess that I can't remember the plural endings. 
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2000
Posts: 2,788
Carpal Tunnel
|
|
Carpal Tunnel
Joined: Sep 2000
Posts: 2,788 |
Quote:
A regular Latin verb's present follows the form:
clamo
clamas
clamat
for the singular and I confess that I can't remember the plural endings.
clamamus, clamatis, clamant
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2005
Posts: 203
enthusiast
|
|
OP
enthusiast
Joined: Sep 2005
Posts: 203 |
Thanks!
Hey, I'm impressed.
By "my Latin is rusty", I meant non-existent. But you lot are Latin grammarians!
And why not? After all, as my Latin For Every Occassion handbook tells me,
Omnia dicta fortiora, si dicta Latina!
Everything sounds so much more impressive when said in Latin!
So true.
Anyway, forgive my stupidity, but does this mean:
De profundis clamavi ad te Domine = Out of the depths, I have cried to you, O Lord.
and,
De profundis clamere ad te domine = Out of the depths, I cry to you, O Lord.
while,
"De profundis clamo ad te domine" = boo-boo ?
Thanks.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 3,467
Carpal Tunnel
|
|
Carpal Tunnel
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 3,467 |
HL:
Your translations are correct, but it isn't an error. Whoever wrote thescreenplay was familiar with the RC mass but was educated enough to change the Latin because he wanted the statement to be in the present voice.
TEd
TEd
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 3,290
Carpal Tunnel
|
|
Carpal Tunnel
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 3,290 |
Actually the word for "to call out, shout" isn't clamo, it's clamere.
Actually, the standard way to list a Latin verb in a Latin-English dictionary is by the first person present indicative form. (This is called the lemma in lexicography, and there are three other forms usually listed, from which, theoretically, one can reproduce the entire verbal paradigm: the infinitive clamare, the first person present perfect indicative clamavi, and the neuter singular past participle clamatum.) (Traditionally any other irregular forms are given after these four, but before the entry proper starts.) Dictionaries gloss the verbal entry with the English infinitival form. Other languages, have other lexicographical standards, e.g., German dictionaries list verbs by the infinitive, Sanskrit by the root. In the end, good enough for Lewis and Short, good enough for me, but I'm not saying you all have to use it, just why I do.
Ceci n'est pas un seing.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 3,290
Carpal Tunnel
|
|
Carpal Tunnel
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 3,290 |
De profundis clamavi ad te Domine = Out of the depths, I have cried to you, O Lord.
and,
De profundis clamere ad te domine = Out of the depths, I cry to you, O Lord.
while,
"De profundis clamo ad te domine" = boo-boo ?
No. Your second sentence is ungrammatical.
1. "De profundis clamo ad te domine" = 'I cry out to you from the depths O Lord.'
2. "De profundis clamavi ad te domine" = 'I have cried out to you from the depths O Lord.'
3. The infinitve of clamo is clamare. You could ad another verb into the mix for something like: "De profundis volo clamare ad te domine." = 'I want to call out to you from the depths O Lord.'
Ceci n'est pas un seing.
|
|
|
|
Forums16
Topics13,913
Posts229,316
Members9,182
| |
Most Online3,341
Dec 9th, 2011
|
|
|
0 members (),
342
guests, and
3
robots. |
|
Key:
Admin,
Global Mod,
Mod
|
|
|
|
