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#121585 - 01/29/04 03:04 PM up, one more time
wwh Offline
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 01/18/01
Posts: 13858
O.Henry is telling a tale of gang warfare. A gang leader
has stabbed a rival, but after hiding for a couple days gets thirsty, and goes to a bar in neutral territory.
It is upstairs, so....


"Now, what is there about Rooney's to inspire all this pother? It is more respectable by daylight; stout ladies with children and mittens and bundles and unpedigreed dogs drop up of afternoons for a stein and a chat."


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#121586 - 01/30/04 02:38 AM Re: up, one more time
hibernicus Offline
journeyman

Registered: 01/19/04
Posts: 79
Loc: Dublin, Ireland
Up:

In Dublin, "up" a road or street is away from the sea or away from the river (thus, north and west if you are northside, south and west if you are southside). This seems to come quite naturally despite the fact that the city centre is pretty flat - people understand without thinking about it which is the "top" of Dawson Street", which way along O'Connell Street is "down", etc.

In Ireland, you go "up" to a bigger town or city, and "down to a smaller one. E.g. "I'm going down to Lanesboro for two weeks, but I'll come back up to Dublin for the weekend". An exception exists for travelling to Ulster, where the convention of North as "up" overrides the other rule - "I'm driving up to Belfast tomorrow".

Finally in rural areas a general convention of "up the road", for a house on the left, and "down the road", for a house on the right, is used, unless the road is obviously sloping.

All this by way of explanation that over here, "drop up to see me" can be used in all sorts of situations without any actual "up"!


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#121587 - 01/30/04 03:17 AM Re: up, one more time
dxb Offline
Pooh-Bah

Registered: 03/06/02
Posts: 1692
Loc: UK
On this side of the Irish Sea we would 'drop in' to Rooney's rather than 'drop up',which I haven't heard before. I don't hear it much used now, but we here go 'up to Town', meaning London, and the 'up train' always was the one you took for London.

Hibernicus, that was interesting about the up and down the street business I hadn't realised that there was any rule to it, just assumed it was arbitrary. Only thing is, doesn't right and left depend on which way you are facing, or which side of the road you are on, at the time you are giving directions? Am I missing the obvious - again?




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#121588 - 02/01/04 12:23 PM Re: up, one more time
TEd Remington Offline
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 07/17/00
Posts: 3467
Loc: Marion NC
We would also drop by.

_________________________
TEd

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#121589 - 02/02/04 11:35 AM Re: up, one more time
hibernicus Offline
journeyman

Registered: 01/19/04
Posts: 79
Loc: Dublin, Ireland
Right and left depend which way you are facing, but if you are walking from "here" that determines which way you are facing (assuming you are walking forwards!)

The "up train" not only goes to London, but also to a university city. In fact, I think the university takes precedence - if you were "sent down" from Cambridge or Oxford, you could be taking the "down train" to London!


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#121590 - 02/02/04 11:40 AM Re: up, one more time
wwh Offline
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 01/18/01
Posts: 13858
I would have thought that to be sent down from either university would mean to be rusticated.


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#121591 - 02/02/04 11:42 AM Re: up, one more time
Faldage Offline
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 12/01/00
Posts: 13803
I think the university takes precedence … you could be taking the "down train" to London!

What?! It's not uphill both ways???

Harrumph®! It's not like when *I was a youngster.


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#121592 - 02/02/04 11:57 AM Re: up, one more time
dxb Offline
Pooh-Bah

Registered: 03/06/02
Posts: 1692
Loc: UK
assuming you are walking forwards! ~ hib.

Oh, I see. I pictured myself standing facing towards the road giving directions to someone!

I hadn't associated being 'sent down' with the railway system. I had taken it as being sent down from a superior establishment rather than a physical movement. That's fun, I must try and chase it down - or do you already have a reference?


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#121593 - 02/02/04 12:00 PM Re: up, one more time
hibernicus Offline
journeyman

Registered: 01/19/04
Posts: 79
Loc: Dublin, Ireland
"Sent down" and "rusticated" are synonyms, both referring to expulsion from university. The implication of the etymologies is that on leaving the university city, you are returning home to a smaller town or countryside. But this is not necessarily the case - your home and hence your destination could be London.


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#121594 - 02/02/04 12:05 PM Re: up, one more time
hibernicus Offline
journeyman

Registered: 01/19/04
Posts: 79
Loc: Dublin, Ireland
I hadn't associated being 'sent down' with the railway system. I had taken it as being sent down from a superior establishment rather than a physical movement. That's fun, I must try and chase it down - or do you already have a reference?

I don't associate "sent down" with the railway system either - sorry if I gave a misleading impression. My intention was to give examples of another convention of "up" and "down" beyond those that had already been mentioned.


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#121595 - 02/02/04 12:46 PM Re: up, one more time
dxb Offline
Pooh-Bah

Registered: 03/06/02
Posts: 1692
Loc: UK
OK, sorry. I read more into it than you intended!


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#121596 - 02/02/04 03:34 PM Re: up, one more time
Capfka Offline
Pooh-Bah

Registered: 06/28/02
Posts: 1624
Loc: Utter Placebo, Planet Reebok
And as the famous Doctor Spooner once said to a student he was rusticating from Oxford: "Sir, you have been caught fighting a liar in the quad. You have hissed all my mystery lectures. You will leave by the next town drain!"


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