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Posted By: wwh Sterotype, cliché - 11/05/02 11:51 PM
Both are used to deprecate tiresomely over-used expressions. Both came from the
printing plate that made printing of many copies possible.
I can not figure out the name of the figure of speech or rhetorical device involved.
Can you?

Posted By: Wordwind Re: Sterotype, cliché - 11/06/02 12:56 AM
http://humanities.byu.edu/rhetoric/silva.htm

You might try this site, wwh. It's been referred to here before. I just read through about 30 terms and couldn't find yours, but there are many there you'd probably enjoy reading through.

Happy hunting,
WW

Posted By: RhubarbCommando Re: Sterotype, cliché - 11/06/02 10:23 AM
can not figure out the name of the figure of speech or rhetorical device involved.


It is similar to a simile - but not quite that. A transferred simile?

Posted By: Alex Williams Re: Sterotype, cliché - 11/06/02 11:13 AM
Wordwind, thanks for that informative link!

Posted By: RhubarbCommando Re: Sterotype, cliché - 11/06/02 11:35 AM
Having thought a bit - and also consulted Wordwind's forest of rhetoric (which is well worth wandering through, BTW)
I am coming to the conclusion that to call something a cliché or a stereotype is, in fact, a metaphor.

Posted By: Faldage Re: Sterotype, cliché - 11/06/02 11:51 AM
metaphor

I think it's gone beyond metaphor to transfered meaning. If you don't know the printing meanings it kinda of loses its metaphor qualities

Posted By: RhubarbCommando Re: Sterotype, cliché - 11/06/02 11:57 AM
I agree that the original meaning has become obscured by the acceptence and understanding of the metaphor as used in a given context.
But hasn't that happened in other cases? Does an individual's lack of understanding of the basis of a metaphor stop it from being one?

Posted By: wwh Re: Sterotype, cliché - 11/06/02 01:54 PM
But the examples given by my dictionary seem different: a comparison is spelled out:
metaphor
n.
Fr m=taphore < L metaphora < Gr < metapherein, to carry over < meta, over (see META3) + pherein, to BEAR16 a figure of speech containing an implied comparison, in which a word or phrase ordinarily and primarily used of one thing is applied to another (Ex.: the curtain of night, “all the world‘s a stage”): cf. SIMILE, MIXED METAPHOR
met#a[phor$ic or met#a[phor$i[cal
adj.
met#a[phor$i[cal[ly
adv.

But when I looked at Metaphors in the new site, it gave examples that DO fit:

"Did you land a job today?" "No, not a bite".
Posted By: Wordwind Re: Stereotype, cliché - 11/06/02 02:35 PM
So, from your example, wwh, it appears that stereotype and cliché were full-fledged metaphors, but have transpired into something else: a metaphor taken from a previous period of time that has lost the metaphorical connection and stands more on its current definition than on the previous metaphorical connection.

I agree with Faldage that this is something that goes beyond metaphor. It is something that typically happens in language all the time--a word derives its meaning from a metaphorical connection, but, after being in use for a long period, that connection could become generally unknown or forgotten.

It's sweet to rediscover those metaphorical connections--like the one Faldage mentioned this morning that onions had previously meant "large pearls," which is definitely metaphorical. We can look at onions now with new appreciation--it returns us to the poetry implicit in language, don't you think?

Posted By: musick Re: Sterotype, cliché - 11/06/02 09:09 PM
Does an individual's lack of understanding of the basis of a metaphor stop it from being one?

Yes! Intrinsic to using the word 'metaphor' is a basis. Without one *it becomes a 'definition' for that individual... IMIO, of course.

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